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    • #1277
      shelly5
      Участник

      My husband has always liked to gamble.  We have been married for 31 years.  We moved to Northern California in 1997 and that’s when he found a small Indian Casino.  He would go there once in a while and usually spend more then he said he would.  It would cause me to get upset, and we would argue.  Then we moved to Oklahoma in 2003 and it didn’t take him long to find another casino.  He would go there pretty often and he would always spend more money then he promised.  We would then argue.  He retired from the Air Force and we moved to Missouri where he quickly found another casino.  He would go there and the same old story with the money.  He would say things like I just got carried away, I was having just having fun, and it’s just entertainment.  In the past couple of years he’s been buying scratchers and lottery tickets almost everyday.  He’s spending a lot of money on that "hobby".  It has really been putting a huge strain on our relationship.  I think that he has a gambling problem, but he doesn’t think that he does.  He thinks he just gets out of control, and he feels like he can control it.  He feels like because we pay our bills every month that he doesn’t have a gambling problem.  I’m to the point that I have realized that I can’t make him change.  I’m about ready to give up.  I feel really depressed and all alone in this situation.  I don’t have anyone to talk to.  Right now I’m so mad and hurt that I don’t even want to talk to him.  I don’t see this getting any better. Take life one day at a time.

    • #1278
      shelly5
      Участник

      I really need some advice.  I understand that I can’t change him.  Trust me I have tried.  When he does gamble how I am supposed to react?  The way I react now is to just get mad. We have had many fights over this.  He mainly just listens, and obviously it doesn’t help. 

    • #1279
      kathryn
      Участник

      Hi Shelley
      Im sorry you have found yourself in this situation but glad you have come here for support.
      I am the compulsive gambler in my home, I have been clean for a while now and I totally understand your frustration with your husband.
      If I may, I would like to give you my insight from my experience (we are all different)
      I have to say, im not sure if any reaction will be taken in any way but a personal attack by your husband.  I know this because after my binges I would be ready for the onslaught from my husband.  Ready with lies to cover my tracks.  This addiction is insidious.  I was once told to imagine my addiction as a snarling beast on my shoulder, whispering enticing thoughts to me to gamble.  Once I separated the addiction from myself I guess it helped me see that I was still the same person I always was, but had been controlled, for want of a better word, by this monster that had taken me over. 
      So, to answer your question,  I guess you have to think that any conversation you have with your husband about his gambling, is not actually to him, its to the addiction.  Because its the addiction that will answer you.  Im not sure if im making sense or not.  I do know that my brain was so consumed with gambling, when to gamble, how to get money to gamble, how to cover up my losses so that I could gamble again that no other thought/conversation could enter my head.  It was only when I stopped gambling that slowly my mind freed up for other things, normal things, day to day things.  To say I missed a lot of my childrens growing up is an understatement.
      I think all you can do at this point is protect yourself, your money and work on your recovery.  Making threats wont work unless you are prepared to go through with them.  Screaming and yelling will just feed the addiction and give your husband the reason to leave and gamble again.  Don’t enable him, perhaps taking control of your life will show him, and the addiction that you will not live with it in your life anymore. 
      My favourite saying is that we are not responsible for our addiction, but we are responsible for our recovery.  The first step, however must be taken, and that is to admit we are powerless over gambling.  I hope your husband gets there. 
      Remember though, you are important, this is not just about him and what he is doing.  It is affecting your life, and that makes it a problem.  Do what you can for yourself.
      I wish you all the best Shelly.  Keep posting here, it really does make a difference.
      Love K xxTo live, that would be a great adventure — Peter Pan

    • #1280
      shelly5
      Участник

      Kathryn what made you decide to stop gambling?  I think my husband realizes that he has a problem.  I don’t think he believes that he’s a CG. I will keep coming here, and I will try to heal.  Thank you for caring.

    • #1281
      adele
      Участник

      Shelly,
      I have brought two threads to the top of this forum that I think will be helpful to you — they were for me and still are. One is the ‘The F&F Cycle’ and the other is ‘How do you react when they gamble?’.
      I hope you will read your thread over and over. A lot has been said to you that may not sink in or make sense the first time you read it, but you most likely will glean something new from subsequent readings. Kathryn’s perspective as a CG in recovery is priceless and I am so glad she posted here for you.
      I want to share something now that Velvet said in her first post to me on my thread. When I first read it I was disappointed and skeptical and could not imagine even considering the words for my situation and where my state of mind was at the time. However, it was not until I accepted their credence that I began to heal and was able open my mind and start implementing real coping skills in dealing with my husband’s addiction. I hope you will thoughtfully consider these words for yourself:
      “I don’t know whether you know the words of ‘Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow’ but I hope they help."
      "There are two days in every week about which we should not worry; two days which should be kept free from fear and apprehension "
       "One of these days is yesterday with its mistakes and cares, its faults and blunders, its aches and pains. Al the money in the world cannot bring back yesterday. Yesterday has passed forever beyond our control. We cannot undo a single act we performed. We cannot ***** a single word we said. Yesterday is gone."
      "The other day we should not worry about is tomorrow with its possible adversities, its burdens, its large promise or poor performance. Tomorrow is also beyond our immediate control."
      "Tomorrow’s sun will rise, either in splendor or behind a mask of clouds — but it will rise. Until it does, we have no stake in tomorrow, for it is as yet unborn."
      "This leaves only one day — TODAY. Any person can fight the battles of just one day. It is only when you and I add the burdens of these two awful eternities — yesterday and tomorrow — that we break down. It is not the experience of today that drives people mad — it is the remorse or bitterness of something which happened yesterday and the dread of what tomorrow may bring. Let us therefore LIVE BUT ONE DAY AT A TIME."
      Adele
       — 9/2/2013 3:10:43 AM: post edited by adele.

    • #1282
      shelly5
      Участник

      Adele my Motto is, "Take life day at a time."  I need to read and re-read all the advice on this forum.  Please hang in there with me.  I had a conversation with my husband today.  I asked if he thought he was a compulsive gambler, and he answered yes.  I asked if he wanted to change, and he said yes.  I asked if that meant forever, and he answered no.  He still thinks he can control it.  I then asked him do you think that a recovering ********* or **** addict could still drink and do ****s.  He said no, but the difference is that’s a chemical dependency.  I don’t think he’s ready to quit.  I think he still thinks he can control it. 
       I asked him if he thinks a separation would be a good idea.  I thinks that I just want an excuse to leave.  I told him I want to give him some space to think about what he really wants in life.  He doesn’t think he ***** that.  I have to admit I have threatened to leave him before.  There are ***** when I think just walking away would be easier.  I do love him.  I just feel like we don’t have anything in common anymore.  
       I’m emotionally and physically drained right now.  I will keep coming here to vent and to get advice.  I can only hope that with time get stronger and understand things better.  I  will try to take this journey one day at time. 
       

    • #1283
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly
      I have seen the rep***s you have had and I hope you are feeling more positive as a result.   Kathryn is an inspiration on this site — her thread ‘Be***ve’ is in our CG forum ‘My Journal’.   You have asked Kathryn a question but I know she is getting on and living her gamble-free life and might not see it so I suggest that you write to her on her thread.
      I see that Adele has pointed you towards my thread ‘F&F cycle’ which I hope helps you see the loop that unfortunately it is deceptively easy to get into.  
      You cannot stop your husband gambling Shelly, accepting that fact will take you forward.  It is often said on this site that if what you have been doing hasn’t worked, then maybe it is time to try something new — reacting differently confuses an addiction that has been in control for a long time. 
      I don’t know whether you have read the following on other threads but I will write it here anyway because although not recognised professionally, I and many others, be***ve it to be an invaluable coping mechanism — I see that Kathryn has touched on it as a coping mechanism for herself.  
       Imagine your husband’s addiction as a slavering beast in the corner of the room.    As long as you keep your cool and don’t threaten that addiction it stays quiet, although it never sleeps and is always ready to ward off potential threats.
      Your husband is controlled by that addiction but you are not.   When you threaten that addiction, it comes between you and controls the conversation or argument.   It is the master of threats and manipulation and you are not.   Once it is between you, you will only hear the addiction speak and because it only knows ***s and deceit, it will seek to make you feel blame and demoralize you.   When you speak the addiction distorts your words and your husband cannot comprehend your meaning.  
      My CG explained it to me by saying that when I told him (for instance) that if he didn’t *** but lived honestly he would be happy, his addiction was distorting his mind convincing him that I was ***** because he truly be***ved that he was unlovable, worthless and a failure – he was a lost soul and fought back because he didn’t have any other coping mechanism.  The addiction to gamble only offers failure to those that own it.    However much your husband convinces you that he is in control – he is not unless you allow it. 
      As you have been married for 31 years your husband’s addiction will have caused a lot of wreckage and by no means, just financially.   My CG was active for 25 years but turned his life around 7 years ago and lives a healthy, happy gamble-free, so my message to your husband would be that he has plenty life ahead of him to enjoy if he changes his life.   However he will probably not listen to me — his recovery will start when he accepts he is a compulsive gambler and wants to change his life and he ***** the right support to do that.  
      Looking after yourself seems too easy an answer but strangely enough it is one of the finest ways to break out of the addiction cycle and can make a massive difference to the person you love, who owns the addiction.  Your husband will not have deliberately hurt you – he didn’t ask for or want his addiction any more than you did.   By changing the one person you can change – which is ‘you’; you will be supporting him in a different way.
       
        
      Your mind will probably have been full of what your husband’s addiction is thinking and doing for 24 hours a day – days of ‘your’ life wasted on his addiction.   It will have caused your self-esteem to crumble and your confidence to fade.  Take some time for you every day and do something that perhaps the addiction has prevented you from doing.   Think of you and your pleasure – think what makes you happy and does not involve gambling.   Build up this time each day.   The addiction to gamble is totally selfish – to enter recovery your husband will have to be selfish and likewise to trigger your recovery you need to think of self first.  
      Your husband will learn when he starts his recovery that he cannot gamble responsibly but it is a daunting thought for him before he takes the leap of faith.  He will feel he is giving up everything he trusts in.   Other CGs and dedicated counsellors can help him move forward and accept that he cannot gamble in the future – it is too big, probably, I think, for you to cope with suggesting to him.    Just as F&F gain from the support of those who understand them – CGs gain support from other CGs.   We cannot save a CG loved one – only the CG can do that.
      You feel emotionally and physically drained but you have started looking after yourself by joining this forum.  It is hard to take the journey one day at a time but on this site the method has proved itself to work over and over again.   I am off on holiday for 2 weeks in a few days but I will look for you on my return.
      Keep posting Shelly.   You are doing well
      Velvet
       

    • #1284
      shelly5
      Участник

      I appreciate all the advice.  I know that I need help.  I don’t feel as depressed as I did on Saturday.  My husband has admitted that he thinks he’s got gambling problem.  I still live in fear that things will not change.  I know that I can’t look into a crystal ball and know what the future holds.  I base all of this on the broken promises that I have heard over and over again.   

    • #1285
      Аноним
      Гость

      Shelly, I asked that same question when I first came to this site. Before (and even after) I realized that I was dealing with a compulsive gambler, I would react very negatively to disappearing money. Who wouldn’t right? Unlike you I did not know the money was going to feed a gambling debt, I thought it was going to support a dying business. So naturally I would be mad at him for taking family funds and more often then not an argument would happen. Even after I realized the money was going to gambling I got upset. I thought since he confessed to me that he was gambling and he was going to GA that the problem (gambling) would just stop. Unfortunately for us that’s not the way it happened. I have had my ups and downs as to dealing with it. What I did first was to secure us financially. I took his name off of anything important i.e. checking, savings accounts and made sure he had access to little to no money. Right now he has to ask me to transfer money to his checking account and I only will transfer *** $15. That’s enough to cover lunch, coffee etc but not enough to allow him to take cash out of an atm. Emotionally it has been a roller coaster…I think finally I am in a good place. I pretty much ignore any behavior that is not positive. If he gambles, I just shut him out. I’ve told him repeatedly I would not be a part of the addiction drama and I am finally showing him that with actions just not words. It’s hard. Because even though you are ignoring him, the addiction still hurts you. And like you said you feel ALONE. That is the worst part for me…is the aloneness. I have two kids but they are getting older and more involved in their own social lives leaving me with more time on my hands. So I am filling the void with furniture!!! I like to restore old pieces that no one wants…this weekend I reupholstered a side chair and feel really proud of myself. Anywhoo I digress…I think Anger has to be the worst way to deal with the addiction at least it was for me. The angrier I got the more confrontational things became. It was a downward spiral. I did tell him that just because I said nothing when he would get his hands on money and gamble did not mean I was ok with it. Gambling was something I was not acknowledging. I’m not sure if any of that helps or makes sense. It didn’t for me at first either. It’s been a process to get to this point and I am proud of where I am at. I hope now that he will catch up with me….eventually.

    • #1286
      shelly5
      Участник

      I can honestly say that I don’t totally understand what everyone is telling me.  Right now I don’t feel as down as I did over the weekend. I’m beginning to see a pattern though. Right now I’m in the hopeful stage.  I’m hoping that this is the time he will really change, but not really believing it.  I have heard so many broken promises over the years. 

    • #1287
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly
      If you could take it all on board so quickly Shelly I would be gobsmacked.  It is difficult not to rush someone to the end of their book without allowing them to read all the chapters on the way to make sense of the end. 
      You have been married for 31 years and there is a possibility your husband has gambled all that time and you didn’t know he had an addiction, possibly didn’t know that such an addiction existed.
      I took months to even believe the existence of this addiction and even longer to believe that it was the cause of my CG’s misery and destructive behaviour.  
      If you look at how long you have lived with your husband’s addictive behaviour, you cannot expect to get your head round it in a couple of days.
      What is important is that you don’t feel as down as you did at the weekend.   You have started on ‘your’ journey to recover the person that is you and to retake control of your life.
      Velvet
       

    • #1288
      pinkfloyd96
      Участник

      Hi Shelly,
      I’m relatively new hear myself, and have been with my CG for a much less significant amount of time, but your story is all too familiar. I can tell you even after being here just a couple weeks, you have definitely come to the right place. I didn’t get it at first either and didn’t even post until after I spent days just reading and soaking this all in. I didn’t want it to be true that my significant other had an addiction and I too believed his promises and tried to share his belief that he had it under control. I rooted for him, I tried to fix him, I even went so far as to participate in the addiction with him..until I finally got real with myself and truly HAD ENOUGH.

      I, like you, was searching everywhere to find answers to the question "how do I literally deal with this issue on a day to day basis"? I wanted step by step instructions…"If he says_____ then I should say _____", "If he does ____ then I should do _____". The realization I personally came to, after reading and re-reading the advice from the wonderful people on here is that there is no right or wrong answer. At least that’s the conclusion I came to…you may come to one that’s completely different. The answer in my own life is that the addiction is cunning and baffling. Its ever changing, shape shifting, manipulating, *****, and insidious and even charming — changing on a daily basis, so my reactions really don’t matter. The best advice I’ve seen so far is the one I fought the hardest against: focus on myself. So far, finding ways to live independent of the addiction has been the most effective tool in "outsmarting" the addiction that I have seen. Just like another person said, you can choose to ignore the addiction altogether. Shut it out and do something that makes YOU happy.

      I think it confuses the addiction…at least that’s what I’ve seen so far in my own life. In fear of losing the enablement, the addiction eases up on the person, and (in my situation) the compulsion slows way down or stops completely, at least for a day or two. It’s a maddening thing to not have control over something that is so obviously detrimental to a person’s well being..having to stand by helplessly and watch them dig a hole. Wondering if your actions and words are giving him a shovel, or a hand to pull him out. The truth is…we really are helpless against it. All the Fighting and screaming and yelling and crying and pouting and begging and pleading in the world won’t change a thing..until the addict realizes they need to change and they take action to change on their own.

      Its our choice whether or not we want to stay and participate in it and its our decision whether or not our "staying" is doing more harm than good. I can only imagine what walking away from 30+ years feels like…even temporarily. Like I said, my situation has been MUCH shorter of a time..but I love this man regardless. I love him enough to let him hit rock bottom without my help and I love him enough to be there, without judgment, when he’s ready to turn it around.

      That’s just where I’m at personally, like I said, I’m new..and this is all just my personal experience. I hope you will keep coming back and sharing because whether you know it or not, you being here seeking help is helpful to others as well. Nice to "meet" you. 🙂 Tomorrow is a brand new day.

    • #1289
      shelly5
      Участник

      Thank you for taking the time to write. I really appreciate the support and encouragement.  For the first time in a long time I feel hope.  My husband has admitted he’s a compulsive gambler.  I’m not feeling confident that he will completely quit gambling. I think he still thinks he has control over it.  I can see the cycle that we both go thru.  Mine is HURT—ANGER—Disappointment—then Hope.  I think his cycle is remorseful—then rationalizing his behavior.   I will keep trying to find ways to cope and heal.
       

    • #1290
      shelly5
      Участник

      I just went back and re-read some of the advice that I have received.  To my surprise it all starting to make sense.  I

    • #1291
      shelly5
      Участник

      I need some advice.  My husband agreed to call a gambling helpline.  He was going to call today, but he said he didn’t because he didn’t know what to say.  I told that I’m sure most people don’t know exactly what to say.  Should I keep encouraging him to call?
       

    • #1292
      adele
      Участник

      Hi Shelly — The people on the gambling hotlines should know how to make him comfortable enough to get him to start talking. My husband finally got in to a chat group here last weekend — (actually, at first he sat next to me while I chatted in Community) then he registered and went in to the CG group by himself. He joined in on several today again, and I’m hopeful he will continue to do so. The Live Advice Helpline here is one on one, and I think your husband would get somewhat comfortable with it fairly quickly. Many ***** the facilitators are CGs in recovery so they have been where our CGs are, and I think this is tremendously helpful! He just ***** to get over the apprehension of the first time …
      Hope this helps…
      Adele

    • #1293
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly

      It would be great to get an update.

      I hope your husband has contacted a helpline, those who have replied to you about this are right – he will be understood the minute he communicates.

      Speak again soon

      Velvet

    • #1294
      shelly5
      Участник

      Things were going pretty good for a while, but I’m worried that he’s going back to his old ways. Last week he said he bought 2 scratcher tickets and this week he said he bought more. Of course I’m upset and very concerned. He’s leaving tomorrow to go in Vacation by himself and I would be lying if I said I wasn’t concerned about him gambling. After all he’s going to visit his Mom and she’s a pretty big gambler herself. If he does I will be very hurt and upset.
      He still hasn’t called the helpline, but I will keep encouraging him to do so. After all he promised that he would, and I’m hoping that he will honor it.

    • #1295
      velvet
      Модератор

      Dear Shelly

      Any gamble to a compulsive gambler feeds their addiction – it doesn’t matter if it is one scratch card or a million pound bet on the poker table the effect on the mind is the same – the addiction is being kept alive. Compulsive gambling has nothing to do with money it is all about the gamble and the excitement in engenders.

      I have yet to meet a CG who controls their addiction without support and I suspect your husband is putting off facing his demons and hoping you don’t notice. Active CGs often lull the non-CG into a false sense of security so that they can carry on with their addiction unabated.

      Unfortunately promises from active CGs are rarely reliable but are often the means to gain time.

      Is his mother aware of your concerns? Does he have to go on this vacation with her? As he is not making any positive moves towards seeking recovery this vacation does not seem to be a good idea at all. If he testing himself to see whether he is a CG by staying with a person with gambling problem then he is not accepting he is a CG.

      Perhaps you could print of the Gamblers Anonymous Twenty Questions for him. You will find them in http://www.gamblersanonymous.org It is good for a CG to realise that they are not alone and they can benefit from reading these questions and recognising the damage they are doing to themselves and their loved ones. Perhaps you could tick the yes answers too so that he can see how much he is affecting you.

      Keep posting Shelly. Knowledge of the addiction will help you cope

      Velvet

    • #1296
      madge456
      Участник

      I see the last post and feel like I am in the same boat — does a little lead to a lot?? I agree with Velvet it is not the size of the bet, it is the action of betting/gaming. BUT, my question is where does this stop? My CG was playing the card game Hearts online. He seemed to me that he was doing something he shouldn’t by his guilty actions. He told me he’d take it off his phone which he never did and i caught him playing it again last night…But he said it wasn’t gambling so that it means it’s ok???- so does that mean he shouldn’t play any card games?? He said «what about bridge?» What about playing the card game «war» with our 7 year old?? He was trying to make me feel bad for what he was doing — put me on the spot when he clearly felt guilty for what he was doing… He then explained to me it was like «an empty bottle to an alcoholic» that he was keeping it around as something he could hold on to — now this sounds like addictive behavior — but where does it stop? No card games at all??
      I ask all this bc I relate to your CG only 2 scratchers — it starts from there — but will it do the same thing with a game of Hearts?? I feel like I am going mad.
      I am not sure if this helps but wanted to know I hear you and understand — they have to want to get help, don’t they???
      XX
      M

    • #1297
      shelly5
      Участник

      I’m pretty sure that his Mom knows how I feel about this gambling. I tried talking to her about it and she just shut me down. I know that talking to her isn’t an option.
      He wants to go there to see her, because he doesn’t get to see her that much. We live in different States. Plus she isn’t getting any younger. I don’t begrudge him going there to see her.
      Thank you for understanding what I’m going thru. I gave him the number again to the Gambling hotline and asked him to please call. I sure hope he does. Thank you again!!!

    • #1298
      nomore 56
      Участник

      Hi Shelly, I also wondered a lot what my hb could or should not do once he started his recovery. He told me that for example playing solitaire on the computer would be a huge trigger for him. The same goes with anything that has only the slightest indication of winning anything. Like a sweep stakes, or the many «review our services for a chance to win a shopping spree» offers. He will not even buy a raffle ticket for a good cause. No monopoly either. I like to compare it to the many challenges an alcoholic faces in recovery. Eating gravy containing sherry or wine can do the trick. Madge, you said that he tried to hide playing a game of hearts and seemed to feel guilty about it. Yes, that is addictive behavior.
      I also agree with Velvet that it is a bad idea at this point in time to visit his mother who evidently avoids or minimizes his addiction. By going there he puts himself in danger and at the same time escapes the «pressure» he feels at home right now to address his gambling. The fact that his mom also has a gambling problem is a huge red flag in my opinion. That is almost like one alcoholic spending his vacation with another one while trying to quit drinking. Try to take care of yourself while he is gone because there is nothing you can do to prevent anything that goes on with him. That is his decision and his alone. Hang in there!

    • #1299
      shelly5
      Участник

      My husband is heading back from Florida. He went to the casino twice while on vacation and he bought a few scratcher tickets. He promised me that he would call the Gambling Hotline. He finally did today while traveling and he said it wasn’t very helpful . He said the lady that he was talking sounded like she just woke up. I don’t think he got much out of the conversation. I told him that he should consider joining this group. He needs support and help.
      Thank you!

    • #1300
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelley

      I sincerely hope it was not our hotline that gave dissatisfaction but please email in if this was the case, we will always take constructive criticism very seriously.

      When a CG makes a positive step towards facing their addiction, as opposed to making promises to do so, it is always a massive step in the right direction. Promises are meaningless and are often churned out to gain time or side-step the issue. Making a positive move implies that the CG is accepting, or is capable of accepting, that their addiction is governing their behaviour and they want to take retake control of their own life.

      It is by far from unknown that family members can keep CGs, who may want to change, locked in to their addiction by actively joining them in the gamble. You are very lenient in your criticism of his mother but by not begrudging him his visits you may possibly be giving him the support he needs. He has to open his own eyes; you cannot do it for him. and criticising a mother-in-law is difficult.

      I don’t know if I have said this to you before but I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t know that the addiction to gamble can be controlled. We have many CGs on the site who control their addiction and who will offer your husband support as only another CG, who understands, can.

      My CG, like Nomore’s hb would not enter a sweep stake or buy a raffle ticket. I remember we had a big discussion on the site once about ebay. My husband, who is not a CG sold a car on ebay and the excitement he displayed, as the auction came to an end, was enough to convince me that if he had been a CG his mind would have been totally out of control. Each CG in recovery has to make their own decisions but they do need the support and experience of others to help them.

      You are doing well posting but you are not saying much about how you are doing and you are important. Living with the addiction to gamble takes away self-esteem and confidence. How do you feel ‘your’ recovery is going?

      Keep posting

      Velvet

    • #1301
      shelly5
      Участник

      Thank you for writing. I have really learned a lot since joining. I have a lot to think about including how I feel.

    • #1302
      adele
      Участник

      Hi Shelly,

      It is so difficult to examine our feelings when we are in the throes of our cg’s addiction. Our emotions are all over the place – reacting to this, worrying about that, expecting one thing and being disappointed in what we get instead.

      I think the most difficult thing for me to accept is that I cannot say or do anything that will make him want do whatever it takes to stop gambling and save our marriage. I’ve been married many years too so it would be difficult to walk away, but that’s what it will come down to in the end for me – gambling or marriage because I refuse to live with this addiction in my life.

      I have a long way to go yet, but some time back, it finally began to sink in what everyone meant in saying “take care of yourself”. And when I began doing that — thinking more about ME and what I feel, and what I want and what I don’t want — instead of constantly allowing my husband’s gambling addiction to monopolize my thoughts, I began to change. I began to feel stronger and more able to stand up against his addiction. And he began to notice a difference in me.

      This is a long, hard, painful and exhausting journey Shelly and I don’t think anyone here would tell you different … but you know by now you are not alone. What you may not know yet is that you can get through this by TAKING CARE OF YOU. Keep reading and posting, you’re doing well.

      Adele

    • #1303
      shelly5
      Участник

      Sorry I haven’t written in a while. I just had an argument with my husband about gambling. It seemed like things were getting better. I found out today that he’s been buying scratcher tickets. Then I found out today that in February he’s going to Las Vegas for work. I really thought that is time he was going to change. I guess in reality I had doubt. It’s hard to believe someone who has made so many broken promises over the years. Is there ever going to be an end! I do love my husband with all heart and soul. I just wish I could magically make this thing go away! Thanks for being here to listen.

    • #1304
      monique
      Участник

      It is good that you took time to write on here — I hope it helps to express your current feelings and know that they will be heard and accepted.

      I think everyone who loves a cg family member — partner, son, parent — would recognize that mix of feeling within you. You have great love for your husband and you desperately want everything to be all right for you both — if only there was a ‘magic’ solution we could tap into!

      Instead, you have had to bravely face your sense of disappointment and betrayal. And perhaps this underlines for you what you also know deep down — that your husband must truly choose to stop gambling and that you cannot, in spite of your love, make this happen, nor be in control in his life. So, can you come back to the one person you can ‘manage’? — yourself. Can you think again of the ways in which you can protect yourself (emotionally as well as practically and financially), take really good care of yourself and maybe even enjoy yourself?

      Sometimes it feels impossible to do those things when our loved one in choosing a destructive path, but ultimately it is the only way for you to survive well and, in the long run, the only way for you to be able to support him, when he becomes ready to make good choices.

      I’m sure I am repeating things you know, but we often need to find courage to pick ourselves up again after disappointment and get ourselves back on our own recovery path — I hope you can find the inner strength to get straight back on yours.

      With best wishes,

      Monique, Gambling Therapy Team

    • #1305
      velvet
      Модератор

      HiShelly
      It’s good to hear from you again but sad to see that your husband still seems hell bent on feeding his addiction.
      Does he have to go to Las Vegas or did he volunteer? A CG in control of his/her addiction would not risk themselves in the gambling city of the world.

      In reality I think it is best to doubt and not trust when there are so many on-going broken promises but the nightmare can end and that choice lies with your husband.

      I appreciate you love your husband but that does not mean you have to love his addiction and you can say ‘no’ to it. Saying ‘no’ is difficult but when put yourself first it is not impossible. You cannot make your husband stop gambling but when you put yourself first and learn to love yourself you become a more formidable enemy to his addiction.

      You asked your husband if he thought he was a CG and he said ‘yes and then you asked if he wanted to change and he said ‘yes and this was probably completely true. When you asked him if he meant it forever, he gave you an honest answer when he said ‘no’. Forever is – well it is for ever and CGs struggle with the enormity of it. I did too when I realised my CG had to give up his way of life forever.

      Your husband is not really accepting he has an addiction –if he did he would not test it with scratch cards. You said he had approached a helpline but hadn’t got the support he needed and I did say that if it was this site that had failed him we would want to know. If you ask the question again ‘do you want to change?’ and he says ‘yes’ then let it be known that it is only one day at a time and nobody will ask him for anything more. We all need hope – controlling this addiction takes an enormous amount of courage and determination. The support is there for him and you will support him the best by looking after you first and foremost because he needs to see that you are strong.

      Being here and listening is the easy bit. Looking after yourself with an addiction in your life is hard but you can do it and we will walk with you every step of the way while you try.

      Pop into a live group sometime and chat in real time. At the moment we have 3 Friends and Family Only groups and the times can be found when you click on ‘Support Groups’ at the top of this page. It would be good to meet you.

      Velvet

    • #1306
      shelly5
      Участник

      Thank you for your advice. It always makes me feel better and encourages me. I asked him to get on this site and check it out.
      He has to go to Vegas for work. It’s a big Education Fair for his job. He’s been there in the past and we usually decide how much he’s going to take for gambling. (Usually over $1000.00) In the past he burns thru in a couple of days and calls home wanting more! I usually feel guilty and give him more. One time I didn’t and he took out a cash advance on our credit card. To say I’m not looking forward to it is an understand statement!
      I asked him to sit down with me tonight so that can talk. Thank you again for all the advice and encouragement.

    • #1307
      velvet
      Модератор

      Dear Shelly
      If your husband was an alcoholic you wouldn’t give him a drink – it is the same with money and a gambling addiction. When you say ‘we’ decide how much money he is going to take gambling you are enabling his addiction — I am not judging, I made too many mistakes myself. Forget feeling guilty when he needs more money – he needs it to satisfy something that is destroying his mind and for that there should be no guilt on your part when you refuse.

      You do not own the addiction Shelly and therefore you are stronger than your husband who is controlled by it.

      Any company worth its salt would never send a compulsive gambler to Las Vegas. If your husband wants to begin to change his life then perhaps he should tell his company that he has an addiction and cannot go.

      I am not surprised you are not looking forward to this trip but I am sure your husband will be in a heightened state of excitement at the thought of going. Your husband is drastically changing reality to fit his personal perception and he needs the support of those who understand him Shelly – this addiction is destructive, it is sustained by lies and deception.

      Keep Posting Shelly

      Velvet

    • #1308
      shelly5
      Участник

      Velvet thank you for replying. I really appreciate it. We had a talk tonight and it I got pretty emotional. He said he doesn’t want to stop gambling. He said he enjoys it. He thinks because he isn’t spending as much as he was that he’s doing better.
      As far as the trip to Las Vegas his company has no idea that he gambles. He would never tell them that he can’t go because of his gambling, because he doesn’t think he has a problem. He’s going to go and he’s going to gamble and that’s the bottom line. It doesn’t matter that I don’t him to.
      I’m so mentally drained tonight. I feel so blessed that I have place to vent. Thank you!!

    • #1309
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly
      Probably most CGs would say that they don’t want to stop gambling but I think they would all agree they don’t like being addicted to it which makes them unable to walk away until they have lost everything which often includes their homes, marriages, families and self-esteem. They would like (and most would believe) that they can gamble responsibly. It is only when reality truly hits them that they are not free and that they are being controlled by an addiction that many realise they need to change if they want to live a decent life. CGs have little incentive to face their addiction as long as they have enablement and they are the masters of manipulation when it comes to getting that enablement

      The addiction to gamble divides families as it feeds on lies and secrecy. Unfortunately unless people have lived with the addiction to gamble, their opinions can be very narrow and not supportive so personally I think it is best to tell others as a statement rather than asking for opinions. You can gather information here so that you can make your own informed decisions with that knowledge especially as your husband is endangering ‘your’ future and other who love you will probably only be able to see that far. Do you have family and/or friends to support you? It is better to share if you can,

      I really, really understand that advising you to look after yourself first seems so lacking in positive help but I have read countless posts from people who had found this message less than they had hoped at the beginning but who grabbed it and applied it to their lives. In changing themselves and refusing the addiction control of their lives they went on to a freedom and happiness that they had given up on. I would never suggest that any member leaves, or stays with their CG loved one – all decisions are yours and all decision are understood and never judged.

      I can hear you love your husband but I want you to learn to love you as least as much because you do matter, you are special and you don’t deserve to be controlled by the addiction of another.

      You said ‘it doesn’t matter that you don’t want him to go’ – dear Shelly it does matter. Do something for yourself today, refuse your husband’s addiction to spoil your thinking and happiness for an hour or two. Each and every day give ‘you’ more time and allow yourself to regain the confidence and self-esteem that your husband’s addiction will have damaged.

      I do know the addiction to gamble can be controlled and I am aware how difficult it is. You do not have that addiction – you can change.

      In the final 5 minutes of a Tuesday group I say the Serenity Prayer for all members – there is a version that I particularly like and it is this.

      God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change
      Courage to change the thing that I can
      And Wisdom to know it is me.

      Keep posting and when your husband goes away on his trip make sure you have plans for you to enjoy ‘your’ life – I would love to hear them.

      Velvet

    • #1310
      madge456
      Участник

      I only have a minute but I wanted to say I have been following your thread and wanted you to know I understand. My husband did the EXACT same thing — no matter what business trip they sent him on, the first thing he would do is look around to see what casinos were near by (and near by meaning within 8 hrs??). He would even on purpose fly into another further away airport , go to the casino , then drive 3 hrs to get to the job site. I would beg him to not go — it became a joke because he would never listen to me and agreed to «not spend too much money». And same thing as with you, since we paid our bills and have a roof over our heads, he thought it was fine and convinced me *sort of* it was fine. But not really. Once he had a meeting in southern california — he wanted to fly into Vegas on a red eye (from east coast where we live), gamble all nite then drive the 5-6 hrs to the job site!! That is crazy but he didn’t see it — I had to scream at him to not do this — but he DIDN»T GET IT! My point only is that until they realize and accept that they have a problem, they wont get it — and they wont stop. I am not sure if my husband has gotten it yet, but (according to him) he has been gambling sober since mid July — who knows if its true.
      I am not sure if this helps but I wanted you to know I have been there and truly understand — the addiction makes YOU feel like the crazy one — and until he realizes he has a problem, Velvet is right that all you can do is care for you and make your own choices. Not enable his bad ones. It is hard.

      I have the same issue in a way with my kids -our therapist told me I want «too much» for them to be happy — so I bend over backwards and do everything for them — and guess what? they are spoiled. And it is my fault. I need to be able to say NO and not feel guilty. Same with my husband.
      **Wanting to take care of and help others at the expense of yourself helps no one**
      I hope this came across as supportive and helpful — that is truly how I meant it. I am trying to rush out the door but had to comment on your post. I hear you and I am with you and support you. Go do something nice for yourself and let your husbands choices go.
      with loving thoughts
      XOXO
      M

    • #1311
      shelly5
      Участник

      Thank you for responding to my posts. I love reading them. I have nobody I can talk to. I could talk to my kids and my brother, but I don’t see how that would help. It might help me to get it off my chest, but my husband will still be the same. ‘
      My husband has made some changes. I have control over the bank account. I put $100.00 in his account weekly. That’s supposed to be his spending money. Well I didn’t realize until a couple of days ago that he was buying scratchers with it. I told him that I was going to drop it down to $50 a week from now on. Or leave it the way it is and he has to use it for cigarettes too. He thinks that he’s doing so much better.
      He said something last night that really didn’t sit well with me at all! He said I just won’t tell you when I gamble so that you don’t get upset. I told him that I don’t want a marriage like that. I don’t want to hide things from each other. I don’t think a married couple should hide anything from one another.
      I will go back and re-read everything and read other posts, so that I can learn to help myself. Thank you again for allowing me to vent my feelings.

    • #1312
      velvet
      Модератор

      Dear Shelly
      You are right to think the words don’t sit well. On one hand your husband is saying that provided you enable him he will tell you when he is indulging his addiction while on the other hand he is saying that if you will not enable him, he will still indulge his addiction but in secret – either way you do not have the marriage that you want and that is his manipulative addiction talking to you.

      Enablement is difficult to understand. Giving money to a CG is enablement, as is paying gambling debts for the CG. Turning a blind eye and giving an active addiction freedom to grow in your life is also enablement and that is what he wants you to do.

      How old are your children? Are they aware that their father has a problem? Children are often more aware that a parent is struggling with the addiction to gamble than is perceived by the non-CG parent. Your brother is possibly aware that you are not as happy as you should be without knowing the reason why or maybe he does know but is waiting for you to talk. I cannot tell you what to do but I do believe that sharing can be very beneficial although there are provisos such as I mentioned in my previous post. The title of your thread does suggest you could do with a physical shoulder to lean on.

      Many F&F think that they have kept the secret of their loved one’s addiction because they have not shared it, in the false belief that it is something to be ashamed about. Siblings, children, parents are often only too aware that there are things that are wrong. Your husband did not ask for or want his addiction any more than you did. He would have placed a ‘harmless’ bet for a bit of fun at one time, like countless others, he was not to know that addiction would waiting for him. There is no shame; he needs support just as you do.

      Your husband might be abstaining for a while hoping you ‘forget’; he might be paying you lip-service because the addiction to gamble is the most devious of addictions. I have yet to meet a CG who can control their addiction for any length of time without support.

      I am glad you have control of the bank account so that you can safe-guard yourself financially.

      You will get stronger, it does take time. Your recovery is important, your self-esteem and confidence will have been battered over the years. Keep venting your feelings, you are creating a journal of ‘you’ that you can look back on and that is incredibly therapeutic.

      Keep posting – you are doing great

      Velvet

    • #1313
      monique
      Участник

      Just want to say I have been following your posts and thinking of you. You have had some great messages with lots of useful information. As Velvet says, you will get stronger.

      I was drawn to your comment about how you could talk to your kids and/or your brother but your ‘husband would still be the same’. I think this is an indication of how you may be focussing too much only on HIS recovery, ie the recovery that is not within your control. It is hard to believe that the person who needs the focus is YOU. But it does work — with time and patience. It doesn’t mean that you no longer care about the cg, but that you put the emphasis on looking after YOU. You don’t have to make any radical decisions about your marriage, but please do focus on improving things where possible for yourself. In small steps, one at a time.

      And, as Velvet says, other family members probably know or at least ‘sense’ what is happening.

      You feel alone, but I hope you will gradually feel that you are no longer so alone.

      Monique

    • #1314
      shelly5
      Участник

      Honestly being able to post here is really helping. I have to let this out. Just knowing that somebody else care really means the world to me . Our daughter’s are all adults in there 20’s, and they are aware that their Dad likes to gamble. They know that I don’t like it. My brother also knows and he can see it. He lives in another State so we don’t get to see him much. My husband’s family knows that he likes to gamble, but they aren’t concerned about it. He just went to Florida in October to visit his Mom and they went to a Casino together. He went to two Casino’s on Illinois and one in Iowa. He won money at the one in Iowa, so it just fueled his desire. Of course he get’s excited when he wins, but I don’t! I know that the Win will only make him to gamble again!!
      After our talk last night he’s been pretty quiet around me. I already feel alone, and this doesn’t help. I guess this is part of the vicious cycle of gambling.
      Today he stopped by grocery store to pick up some things he needed and he said he bought 2 scratcher tickets. After the conversation we had last night it really felt like a slap in the face. I’m sure in his mind I’m just being unreasonable and I don’t understand. I don’t understand that he really enjoys gambling. He thinks he’s making changes and it’s just not good enough for me. I just can’t seem to get him to understand how concerned that I am and how I want him to quit!! I then start to doubt myself and I think that it’s partially my fault. I start thinking that maybe I’m being unreasonable. I sometimes would like just runaway, but in reality I would never do that! I guess I just want a break from reality!
      Thank you again for this group!!

    • #1315
      monique
      Участник

      It really is SO frustrating trying to get a cg to really hear how you feel about the addiction — so frustrating, it probably isn’t worth doing. The cg will only hear, when he has changed inside himself. Velvet has some great descriptions which she has no doubt shared already about talking to a cg being like talking to someone with their head full of water! It is maddening, so I hope you can give yourself a rest from it — a little something that will release you a bit?
      An escape from reality? — I imagine that is an escape from the reality of your husband’s gambling. But I would venture to say that that is not really avoidance of responsibility in the way we usually think of it — do not take on guilt about putting HIS addiction aside. If you can ‘escape’ into something you really enjoy, that will do you good, I think — what takes your fancy? What makes you joyful? Something you can get ‘lost’ in for a while? — music, dancing, a good book?? I don’t know, but whatever it is, have a go today, I suggest.

    • #1316
      madge456
      Участник

      As i read your post, it sounds so much like things I have said/posted in the past — I can relate to being «slapped in the face» — you cant even believe what the cg did bc you *just* talked about it and they go and do it anyway. It is frustrating and makes you feel like you are going crazy. WHich leads me to your «doubting myself» comment — because yes, when they do something we said we objected to, the addiction tried to twist it around so we start to feel like we are the ones in the wrong «what could it hurt? it’s only a little money..» etc etc Making us feel bad (at least in my case) and some times relenting and giving in. This just makes everything get worse in the long run.
      It is so hard to stand your ground but you must. For yourself. Last time my cg did something like this (2 days ago!) we talked about it and I told him I would not be treated like that. If he wants to disrespect me I can’t be in a relationship like that. I have gotten to the point where I have said if he acts this way he needs to leave. This is a big deal for me and surprisingly my cg is really trying hard to gain my trust and change himself. And I think that is partially due to the fact that I told him I couldn’t — wouldn’t put up with it anymore. My story is a little complicated (all in my posts if you want to catch up) but the thread is the same — they act out, we protest, they cajole, we feel guilty and bad about ourselves and confused. It is painful, heartbreaking and demoralizing.

      Like Monique and velvet said, taking care of yourself, finding support for yourself are very important. It sounds like a silly pollyanna thing to say, but it does really help. I have found posting and replying to others posts very therapeutic as well. It is nice to be understood and not judged.
      I just wanted to say I hear you and encourage you to reach out to anyone (real or in cyber-land) who you think could be supportive of you. Just talking to a friendly ear is cathartic in so many ways.
      With love
      xx
      M

    • #1317
      velvet
      Модератор

      sorry Shelly I was writing a post to Madge and put it on your thread by mistake. I can’t seem to get rid of my footprint though.

      V

    • #1318
      shelly5
      Участник

      Life is like a rollercoaster with it’s ups and downs. Living with GC can really suck. Just when you think that things are getting better it goes downhill. I just need to get over being mad and sit down and talk to him. Not that it does any good, but I have to have some hope! Everyone tells me to not get mad, but I can’t help but feel that way. I feel ANGRY , MAD, HELPLESS, and depressed. I just want him to know that and acknowledge how much he hurts me!

    • #1319
      monique
      Участник

      Yes, life with a cg ‘can really suck’. I hope it has helped expressing your feelings here, where they WILL be heard and understood.

      I think it is a really difficult one to grasp and then to put into practice, but it is worth it for your sanity — that is, the acceptance that it can be just plain useless trying to talk rationally and sensibly with your cg and to have expectations that he will ‘take in’ what you say and how you feel. He SHOULD do these things and you deserve to be heard and understood, but whilst addiction is active, these things don’t happen. In early recovery, a cg is also usually unable to ‘give’ to others.

      So it is to save yourself further anguish that people advise you not to get mad etc — your feelings and thoughts are completely valid and understandable, but it’s just that a cg is not the person who can meet the needs you have right now. If you don’t expect this support from him, you will, hopefully, not feel so frustrated and angry??

      Instead, go back again to what YOU can do for YOU (and also go back to other sources of genuine support and understanding, of course). Separate yourself and your needs from him in your mind and look after YOU. How can you do that? What things, unrelated to him, will help you right now? What do you want to do, to enjoy etc, just for you? It doesn’t have to be anything big but just something(s) for you.

      Wishing you well,

      Monique

    • #1320
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly
      I imagine you feel as though you are on a piece of piece of elastic bouncing up and down, day in day out, year in year out — every time you feel better you bounce right back into the mire of addiction again – it’s enough to make anyone angry and mad.
      I fully appreciate that being told that looking after yourself doesn’t seem a fantastic answer to your problems — but it is.
      I remember one member who came back and told me that she had never believed that looking after herself would make an iota of difference. When she last posted she was a changed person, she was feisty and strong and living ‘her’ life as she wanted it to be, doing the most amazing things. She is far from alone in the success stories on this forum but I remember using the elastic analogy with her and she recognised that, that was how she felt and she resented her husband’s addiction having that pull over her. I remember her particularly because she said that she had really believed I was wrong and I thought it was great that she came back to tell me.
      Being bounced up and down by an addiction you do not own will make you feel helpless but cutting that elastic and freeing yourself will give you control of ‘you’ and take away the feeling of helplessness.
      I wish I could say that ‘just’ sitting down and talking to your husband would make his addiction listen but if he doesn’t want to give up his gambling then all the tears, pleading, rational discussion, love in the world will do nothing. You want him to know that you are depressed and acknowledge that he has hurt you but he will only be able to do that when he changes his life and he won’t change his life if he doesn’t want to stop gambling.
      Keep posting Shelly – I know it seems you are hitting your head against a brick wall but chinks of light will appear.
      Velvet

    • #1321
      dairyklimy
      Участник

      i read this thread and it talks about the gamblrr when he engages in gambling the partner should disengage and shut him out. in my case its the reverse. my gambler is shutting me out. im not sure if he is still playing because he does it secretly and we do not live togther. but he tells me that he feels pressured and stressed in my presence or just even beginning to talk to me. and we have not even started a topic yet. i feel like he has a lot on his head. he has not been contacting me. thats why im confused. he is the one shutting me out. iv tried all ways yo compromise with him just so we could work out a relationshp. but all he tells me is how he wants space.. anf i guess that means having zero contact. i guess thats his way of working on his recovery. which i really dont get. abd cant get. whats making sure we talk even for just once a day…. i feel so left out and alone.

    • #1322
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Dairyklimy
      I am hoping that you are going to return to this thread. I appreciate that you are reading other posts but each and every member has a different story and each and every person who posts receives unique replies so please start your own thread. Scroll to the bottom of the F&F Forum page click on ‘New Topic’ and follow the simple instructions.
      Most F&F recognise your feeling of being disengaged by a CG (compulsive gambler)and I would love to communicate with you directly.
      You are not alone when you are here. You are understood and I and others want to support you.
      Velvet

    • #1323
      shelly5
      Участник

      Today isn’t a good day. The gambling problem hasn’t gotten any better. I try hard to deal with it—well maybe I just try to ignore it. Yesterday my husband had to go out of town on business, and in the back of mind I knew that meant he would go to a casino. Unfortunately I was right. I got a phone call in the afternoon from asking me if I minded if he took out $160.00 and went to the casino. I said what do you think. Of course I don’t want you to go. Then he started making a deal. If I go to the Casino I promise not buy any scratcher tickets for the next two weeks. By that time I was already upset. I just said do whatever you want to do. Your 51 years old and you can make your own decision. Well his decision was to go to the Casino. (Huge surprise there!) I am done trying to stop him. I have no control over the addiction. I’m just going to let him do whatever he wants. I wanted so bad to just leave last night. I feel trapped in a vicious cycle.

    • #1324
      velvet
      Модератор

      Dear Shelly
      In my opinion everyone who loves a CG will have times when they try to push this horrible addiction to the back of their minds in the hope it will go away, only to have it brutally shoved back to the forefront again as the addiction reasserts itself.
      It never left your mind completely though and until your husband has accepted his problem and sought support it will always be in his mind too and not at the back.
      I think your handling of your husband’s addiction was terrific even though I know you are feeling defeated. You told him that it was his choice and you recognised that you could not control his addiction. That is not defeat, that is acceptance and without acceptance it is hard to move on.
      I would never tell anybody to go or to stay – I know your husband can change or I wouldn’t be writing to you but there are no magic words to give you to make your world feel right instantly.
      I know my words seem rather pathetic when you are faced with the enormity of an active addiction but looking after yourself is the best way for you to cope – both with yourself and with him. I don’t know of any CG who thanked those who love them for trying to make them stop gambling but I have heard many who say thank you for not becoming victims. Taking yourself out of the cycle isn’t easy but just as I know your husband can change I know that you can live at the centre of your life and not on the periphery of his.
      I’m going to close but my thoughts are with you. I will finish with the Serenity Prayer that F&F always say at the end of Gamanon meetings and also my favourite alternative. When you read them I want you to know that, just as in Gamanon your hand is being held around the world, in cyber space, by those who really understand including many of us who no longer live in the shadow of the addiction.
      The Serenity Prayer
      God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change
      Courage to change the things I can
      And Wisdom to know the difference.
      And the alternative
      God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change
      Courage to change the thing that I can
      And Wisdom to know it is me.
      Speak soon Shelly
      V

    • #1325
      shelly5
      Участник

      I know that I need to hand this over to God, and I know that I can’t change him. Home life is stressful as I don’t want to talk to him. You can feel the tension in the air.
      I realize this a vicious cycle that has repeated itself over and over again .

    • #1326
      shelly5
      Участник

      Last night as I reading thru this thread, I was thinking that maybe I should let him read this. Is that a good or a bad idea? I really don’t think that he has a clue how much this really upsets me, and makes me feel inside.

    • #1327
      velvet
      Модератор

      Hi Shelly
      I promise you that this is not me opting out of reply but I cannot tell you what to do. This is your thread and your support and what you do with it has to be in your hands only.
      If you are unsure it is often best to do nothing until you are ready to make an informed decision. If you want to push your thoughts around more just keep posting or perhaps pop into the group on Tuesday – it would be great to communicate in real time.
      I hope that re-reading your thread helped you.
      Speak soon
      Velvet

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