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    • #5243


      My other half is a gambler, which is often exasperated by drink and I’m not sure how to help. They have never openly admitted to me that there is a problem but have previously challenged themselves to a «sober month» or that they will stop. They are currently excluded from their online accounts but are still going to shops to place bets.

      They have obviously made a real effort to make sure Christmas could go as smoothly as possible and they did well on delivering on what was promised, which is something that hasn’t happened before, such as being where they were suppose to be and having the right gifts.

      January has proven to be more of a struggle. The couple of times we have been in a social drinking environment have been difficult and abusive and this has been recognised by them as a problem. This is resulted in a real desire to make changes, one of which is for us to live together (they are currently with their parents living and working in an area that is totally detrimental to any attempt at recovery).

      Moving closer to me would be enough to provide a fresh start. However, my concern is that in doing this I would just be an enabler. They currently do not have control of their own finances; previously they were looked after by an ex and now a parent. And going forward, it would need to be me.

      I care about them an awful lot but the lack of acknowledgement of the real problem and the thought that i am exposing myself to financial problems and further manipulation in the future is a real concern.

      I don’t know how best to help. To get them to seek help appropriately. All fam & friends say that it will only end in disaster and that’s what the logical side of me knows and what I would be saying to someone else. However, my love for them and the emotional side makes me want to protect them and help them. I know that they need to want to do it for themselves first, I dont know how to get to that point….

    • #5244


      Hello Logic

      Thanks for starting a thread in the Gambling Therapy friends and family forum. This forum will provide you with warmth and understanding from your peers.

      Feel free to use the friends and family group, you’ll find the times for these if you click on the “Group times” box on our Home page. Now that you have introduced yourself you’ll find that many of the people you meet here have already read your initial introduction and they’ll welcome you in like an old friend 🙂

      If you’re the friend or family member of someone who is either in, or has been through, the GMA residential programme please take extra care to make sure that nothing you say in groups, or on our forums, inadvertently identifies that person. Even if your loved one isn’t connected with GMA, please don’t identify them either directly or indirectly just in case they decide to use the site themselves.

      You’ll find a lot of advice on this site, some of which you’ll follow, some you won’t…but that’s ok because only you fully understand your
      situation and what’s best for you and the people you love. So, take the support you need and leave the advice you don’t because it all comes from a caring, nurturing place 🙂

      We look forward to hearing all about you!

      Take care

      The Gambling Therapy Team

      PS: Let me just remind you to take a look at our
      privacy policy and terms and conditions so you know how it all works!

    • #5245

      Hi Logic
      How did the sober month challenge go? Unfortunately, alcoholic drink appears to be an essential at social events — and when drink flows resistance is generally lowered. I am interested that your other half sees living with you as being the answer and although I cannot tell you what to do I am hoping that your choice of username is a strong pointer to your character.
      Your family and friends are obviously concerned about you but although I do not believe that disaster is an inevitability, I think you should learn all you can about gambling addiction before you make any move at all. Informed decisions are so much better that jumping in and hoping for the best.
      You are right when you say that a CG (compulsive gambler) has to want to control their gambling for their own sake and that you cannot make your other half stop for you.
      If you were to fast forward in your mind, do you see a peaceful future in maybe 6 months to a year? If you do not, which in my opinion would be the case, then I suggest you listen to your logical self. Controlling addiction takes time, courage, determination, single-mindedness and starts with acceptance of the problem followed by action. At the moment, you say, your other half is still placing bets in shops and this is not indicative of a person who is seeking change. Maybe your other half could be encouraged to self-ban from all the local betting shops as a first indication that he/she is prepared to do more than just talk about changing their life.
      Actions do speak louder than words and I don’t hear your partner’s actions and thoughts as being conducive towards controlling their addiction or addictions. I assume from the fact your other half’s parents are handling his/her finances that they are aware of the problem which is good. Sadly there are many parents who ‘know’ there is a problem but enable through ignorance or simply because they have not got a clue how to deal with the problem that they didn’t ask for or want.
      I agree it would be a fresh start for your other half to move closer to you but It seems to me that all the good bits of this ‘fresh’ start appear to belong to your other half. If it was me I would want to see a big change before I undertook such a relationship; for instance, if your other half were to attend GA or AA, or maybe join this site and its terrific CG groups or talk to our Helpline about ways forward — positive action rather than just words which are easy,
      I am sorry you haven’t had other replies, our forum is very quiet at the moment but please post again soon and maybe pop into the F&F group on Tuesday 20.00-21.00 hours UK time.

    • #5246

      Hi Velvet,

      Thanks for you kind words and taking the time to reply to this!

      The sober month challenge went well initially. He made it to about 3 weeks and caved in on the drinking first. This was due to his work colleages, ironically, betting on him to fail. One of the guys cut him in on the bet if he gave up and had a drink. Once he had failed with the drinking, he saw this as a failure of fhe whole thing and the gambling soon followed. I was really proud about how he had done but so disappointed that the peer pressure became too much.

      I totally agree with what you are saying about becoming more informed. That’s why i have reached out to you guys. Really i need help with how to be supportive to him without enabling him. Its such a fine line.

      My username was a deliberate choice. I am trying to be as logical as i can be but its sometimes easier said than done when emotions are involved.

      I think peaceful happiness would be a struggle in the next 6-12 month and would be difficult but not impossible. I have set boundries for what i would expect (although that hasnt extended to limits on how he gambles as i feel that needs to come from him rather than me telling him). And now things are left in his control. I feel that if he is as desperate to make change as he says he is, he needs to come to a point that he does something about it.

      I try to challenge his management of money with little tasks that require some forward planning and allocated money but if they fall through its not a financial concern. Meaning that there are fun activities to aim for away from gambling. Sometimes it works well, sometimes it spectacularly fails.

      For him, there is no acceptance of the fact that there is a problem. And that is the part i struggle with the most. It is an off topic matter. He has said that he doesn’t want to change who he and that counselling isn’t something he would ever do. So this is the other problem i have: trying to get him to engage with something like this would be practically impossible.

      For my CG, actions really do speak louder than words. And i would want that big change that you talk about before i could live with him. At the minute its almost a battle of wills, how long i can carry on v how long he will hold out on the fact that there is a problem. I’d love to see positive actions but i don’t know how he can get to that place without accepting that there is a problem. Or how we can move forward.

      With regards to the families — on my part, my friends just don’t know enough about it and, understandably want to protect me. His family have much more experience with addiction to a point that they are almost numb from it. So talking to either side would be a challenge.

      I feel like this is more ranty than my first post and probably much more disjointed…sorry about that but i do appreciate the response.

    • #5247

      Hi Logic
      I heard you putting the ‘flesh on the bones’ in your second post and not a bit of ranty anywhere. I think disjointed is the way it would come out if we were talking and as such I found it easy to follow your train of thought.
      I was told by a CG a long time ago that when his addiction was active, what ‘he’ wanted and needed was to gamble and that what ‘I’ wanted and needed didn’t matter one jot – it brought me up short and helped me to make some sense of a lot of what had gone before.
      In a battle of wills I’m afraid the gambling addiction has the upper hand because it is the master of manipulation and you are not and nor do you want to be. Addiction doesn’t do logic and reason – it defies sense, which is very hard to accept when a person loves a CG but in my opinion, it is better to know what you are facing.
      I am interested that you have found that fun activities away from gambling can be a distraction for your other half although sadly you say that even these can fail. It is one of the hardest; if not ‘the’ hardest thing for a CG who determines to live in control of his addiction, that he feels there is a void that cannot be filled because the addiction has often alienated friends, family and other interests and hobbies which would only have got in the way of the ‘gamble’.
      I’m not sure what you mean by ‘finances not being a concern’ but I imagine he has possibly earned enough to cover his gambling debts — so far. The addiction to gamble though is not about money it is solely about the ‘gamble’ and it is the ‘gamble’ that alters the personality and can make the kindest of people behave intolerably — money is the tool of the addiction – not the goal.
      If your other half is a compulsive gambler then, in my opinion, you setting boundaries is unlikely to have any effect. The addiction can be controlled but not ‘cured’ and abstention alone is not enough. If there was a magic pill or a simple guide to controlling a gambling addiction then this site, GA, etc would not exist. At the risk of being disjointed myself I am returning to your paragraph about the colleague who seemed to be the cause of your partner caving in after three weeks. Your partner did not know how to handle his colleague or the way his addiction made him feel when his resolve slipped — but his colleague was not to blame.
      It takes time to process all the information about gambling addiction but I’m not going anywhere so please keep posting.

    • #5248

      Thanks, Velvet. I think I could rant for England on this issue! And it feels so self centered. I’ll try not to rant though as that won’t help anything!

      Yes, that comment from the CG makes total sense to me and my situation. With my CG, it is clear that he does care about me and knows that the way he is acting isnt good enough. But he cant stop. Or, more importantly, he doesnt want to. He often talks about how hard he tries to keep everyone happy but doesnt manage it. The guilt eats him up, but not enough to make a change…

      Like I said, some of the fun activities fail. This weekend was one of them. There was an opportunity for a cheap weekend getaway, which is something he has talked about doing non-stop for ages and the perfect opportunity arose. All it took was putting money aside for booking low cost airline flights. The excuses came out, the delays on doing it and eventually the money had run out. It all feels like such a set back and I know I am not dealing with it in the best way.

      When I said «finances not being a concern», I meant it in two ways. Firstly, and most importantly, that there is no financial impact on me. This is something I have learnt the hard way. If he has no money to do it, we dont do it. Secondly, because of the way he chooses to live, he lives a very simplistic lifestyle. He is paid weekly so he, luckily, doesnt have the struggle of blowing a full month’s wage but his limited lifestyle outgoings means that his wage is almost all disposable income. That then goes into the bookies back pocket.

      The moodswings and intolerable behaviour are what I find the most hardest to deal with. Do I fight fire with fire andstand my ground on the unacceptable behaviour? Do I sweep it under the carpet and ignore the issue…again? Do I let emotion take over and get underwhelmed and upset? Usually, a horrible combination of all 3. And that’s where I feel like I am letting him down. I cant support him enough.

      I completely agree that abstention isnt enough and he needs real help but he is totally unwilling to face up to any of this and definitely wont seek help (I want to say «at this stage» but that may be optimistic!)

      I know that no-one else is to blame for the choices my CG makes. However, the environment around him is so destructive and has so many layers to it, it is a whole issue in itself.

      Velvet, thank you again for your support. I didnt realise how much i needed an outlet for this. Gambling seems like such a secretive addiction with no obvious symptoms and such a mystery around it. I too have fallen into the see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil trap. And that needs to change!!

    • #5249

      Hi Logic
      Like you i didn’t know how much support I needed until I got it and it was like an oasis in the desert – I lapped it up because for the first time in years others made sense of the experiences I had had even if it was only to say ‘that happened to me too’. The more voices that said the same thing the more I realised I was not alone. The more voices that told me how they had successfully handled the addiction in their lives the more clearly I saw the way I had to move forward to survive.
      I know It isn’t the loss of money that is the problem (although It causes terrible distress and hardship) but it is the mood swings and intolerable behaviour that is hardest to deal with. It becomes easy to believe that the problem is yours because why would **** say or do these things to you. A relationship cannot be healthy when there is a lack of honesty and fighting fire with fire is probably the reaction of most F&F but it doesn’t work.
      I can see a fourth way for you cope rather than sweeping it under the carpet, ignoring the issue or letting emotion take over so that you get underwhelmed and upset? It isn’t easy to do even if it is, in essence, simple and it does make a difference – it is looking after yourself more than you have been doing. It is setting time aside every day for interests, hobbies and friends that have no connection whatever to do with gambling or your partner. It is re-finding yourself and showing your partner’s addition that you are stronger than it will ever be. It is changing yourself into the rock on which he can fasten himself to stop himself sinking, or he can choose to sink while you stay strong and firm — it is giving him freedom to choose.
      If those who love CGs allow themselves to be dragged down into the slough of despond with an addiction that they do not own then they will not be strong enough to survive themselves never mind being strong enough to support their CG when they determine enough is enough.
      It is, as you so rightly said, a battle of wills but his will is not his own – he is controlled by an addiction that only he can change. If you stand your ground and say enough is enough for you, which is not saying that you stop caring about the man you love, then hopefully he will accept sooner, rather than later, that the responsibility of his addiction lies with him. As long as you continue with the status quo there will probably be no moving forward with your partner, in my opinion, it would be better if you took over the driving seat and moved yourself forward, showing him the way by example.
      My favourite version of the Serenity prayer is .
      God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change
      Courage to change the thing that I can
      And Wisdom to know it is me.
      Please keep posting and using the group which never seems to be long enough.

    • #5250

      Today marks almost two weeks since my CG and I last drank together. Today marks almost two weeks since my CG last had a drink. Today my CG fell off the wagon.

      I know that gambling is my CG’s overwhelming vice but drink does him no favours either. But today i got a little bit stronger.

      He made a few references to wanting to have a beer when we last met midweek but didn’t drink and said he was enjoying not drinking. I told him how well he had been doing without drink and not much more.

      Again today my CG tested the waters debating if he should have a beer or not. But it was different. Almost seeking my approval to cave. Again i reminded him how well he had done and that it was up to him if he wanted a beer or not.

      He got mad. Accusing me of judgy looks and being in a mood. I reminded him that i hadnt said anything about him having a drink. Its not up to me to make decisions for him. He is big enough to do that himself. That resulted in him pulling into the off licence and coming back with his beers.

      We got home, enjoyed our meal and he had a coke. I hoped that this was just pushing for a reaction but my heart leaped everytime he went to the fridge. Eventually he came back with his beer, offered it to me, i declined as i was driving so he poured it for himself.

      I said nothing and after a few minutes of debating with myself i realised i wasnt happy in that situation (the last time he drank was not a plesant experience and not something i want to be around again, he doesnt want to be like that towards me either).

      So i said so. I said i thought it was better that i left as i wasn’t comfortable being around him at the moment when he was drinking. He agreed that i should leave as i had said the one thing that has destroyed our relationship (i let that comment slide). I stayed and tried to open the lines of communication. He told me he didn’t want to talk, and for the first time, without tears and without shouting, i left. I hugged him and let him know how much i love him before i left but i was clear and strong in doing the thing that was best for me.

      I don’t know if i have done the right thing for my CG. I don’t know what it will do to my relationship. What i do know is that it was the best thing for me to do at that moment.

      Today i got a little bit stronger.

    • #5251

      Hope you had an enjoyable few days of celebrations. Thanks again for the message. The more i engage in this the more thereputic i find it and its so comforting to lnow there are other people there for support.

      I know that my relationship isn’t healthy and all i can do it be as honest as i can with my cg and hope that he wants to be that honest with me too. I’m still working towards a discussion about his gambling but that’s still a future dream/hope.

      I am starting to take care of myself. I do need that more. I have a girls holiday coming up which I’m excited about. Obviously i will be leaving CG behind but I’m much clearer now on the «I’m responsible for me, you are responsible for you» so am less worried about leaving him behind.

      I’m trying option number 4 more and more and my post above was my first start in this. Yesterday CG told me about money that he has now saved for a car. I praised him on having the money to do something positive and said i hoped he did something really positive with it. Now its just fingers crossed and see if he can deliver on it!!

      Today CG also discussed that it is likely that he will be taking a week off for an upcoming event which indulges his favourite form of gambling. From what i know of his brother already doing this before. It is a week off, in the pub gambling for the whole day, for a whole week.

      Obviously i would much prefer for CG to be in work ( and even if he was he would only work in the morning so there is still plenty of pub time). I don’t even know how to deal with this. Saying anything negative goes against my whole «you decide» attitude. But the idea of him spending a whole week in the pub drinking and gambling fills me with dread.

      I think the status quo has come about as i see it now that i am making his life easier rather thank making it better. They are two separate things. I don’t know how to break the cycle. I want to stand my ground but he will see it as an ultimatum. He will push away and that kills me.

      CG isn’t speaking to me and i am about to go away on a work trip ( to where cg and i should have gone away). Everything is up in the air. Which is stressful for me as a fixer. I just have to let the land lie now i guess.

      I won’t be in the group chat this week as i will be travelling. Hopefully i will be back (and on time) next week. Meanwhile i will keep posting

    • #5252

      Your strength inspires me…its hard to know whats right or wrong to do…its hard for me not to question (or monitor as my husband says)…but this is all so new im changing everything about me so i can learn to deal with correctly my CG … im a wife and its stuck in the back of my head «this is your right» but i need to stop and think «this is whats right»..ty again for your inspiration and i congratulate you on your stregnth.

    • #5253

      So right now it is hard. I am out of the country on a business trip so cant really do more than text my CG.

      After i walked out, I let CG know I was home safe and how much I had enjoyed the rest of our weekend. I also text to let him know I had landed safely. I heard nothing apart from him telling me to use the trip to move on and I was making him out to be a monster. I tried to reassure but that didnt go well.

      The last I heard from CG was a text saying «yeah whatever…so long logic». And i dont know what to do next. I sent a screenshot of a previous conversation of him saying how much he needs me to communicate with him and let him know when he is slipping up.

      But I have now seen comments on the my journal page of a CG that resents being reminded of what they have previously said and now I’m worried that I have done something wrong.

      For now its radio silence on both sides. I dont know what to do. During the day it is easier as I can distract myself with business. I’m scared about having to go back to the hotel room. every fibre in my being wants to contact him and sort this out…i know i cant. but it is so hard. Really struggling here.

    • #5254

      Hi Logic
      Stop worrying about sending your CG a screenshot – he wrote the words and they were words composed by him when he was in a better frame of mind and wanting to know when he was slipping up.
      He has slipped up and you reminded him just as he asked – you have done nothing wrong.
      Enjoy your travelling and please don’t let something you read in another forum cause you to feel any apprehension – you did well and if you are in any doubt perhaps you could contact our Helpline as I know you can’t make the group this week.
      Speak soon

    • #5255

      Thank you for writing to me. I really need that right now.

      I’m having a tough time with work and am carrying a lot of anxiety. More than any anxiety that I have felt before…

      Rejection and disengagement from my CG isnt helping but I know that even if we were talking he couldnt help with my anxiety anyway. I just miss having him there.

      Just feel quite worthless and unloved right now and am desperately trying to protect myself.

      I will try and get onto the helpline but it wont be today so I will have to try and keep strong. I’m not as strong as i hoped or thought.

    • #5256

      So i’m back in the UK.

      Messages between CG and I have returned but are very strained.

      His child wanted to see me which i think soften CG up a little bit and is hard for me as it is not easy to be away from them both (I dont think that is a guilt tactic, i think realising that his child was missing me made CG think about things a little)

      He is seeing everything as me creating the problems and trying to cause drama whilst he wants to lead a stress-free life.

      I have been trying to point out that he needs to communicate better and that there will be stresses in his life whether i am in it or not. He is basically putting up every shield he knows to withdraw from me.

      We will see how it goes. Velvet, i did speak to the helpline, it was nice to get some support so i will keep pushing with helping myself before I can help anyone else…

    • #5257

      So today I found out my partner has been suspended from work enquiring investigations. My partner confessed all telling me he had been stealing from work to gamble. He has always dabbled in gambling or gone to the races etc but just before Christmas apparently his gambling got worse. I really don’t know what’s goin to happen now, he’s obviously going to lose his job but I’m praying they don’t get the police involved as this will ruin him. He will have a criminal record and it would be very doubtful he would get a job again and I’m very worried. We have deleted everything and banned him from all betting shops etc and I now have full control over his finances but I’m worried sick about our future.
      He is genuinely gutted, I’ve never seen him cry before but he was shaking and breaking down its was horrible. I know he is deeply sorry and I will support him as much as I can but I really am s**ting myself about the police situation! Any advice is hugely appreciated x

    • #5258

      Hi Michelle
      Please start you own thread, it isn’t possible to give you the support you want on someone else’s thread.
      Some CGs (compulsive gamblers) steal to get money to indulge the addiction they own, an addiction they neither asked for nor wanted – there is no judgement on this site.
      Start your own thread by scrolling to the bottom of the F&F forum, click on ‘New Topic’, give yourself a ‘Subject’ heading then write your post in the box, (the one you have written here is fine), scroll down and click on ‘Save’.

    • #5259

      Thank you Velvet, I wasn’t sure how to do it. X

    • #5260

      Yesterday I saw CG after all of the ups and downs of the past few days. There was no discussion about what had happened as I knew he wouldnt want to talk about it.

      Sadly, I knew that he had been gambling hard the last few days, which is tough to see but isn’t my fault. There is still evidence of him wanting to make positive changes so I am holding on to that for now.

      It is scary to think about how much affect me walking away has on his gambling. But what is really worrying is how much he suppresses. I asked him whether he had thought about us much over the few days away. He said that he hadnt thought about us at all.

      The gambling illusion is back, bigger and bolder than ever with the multitude of excuses/lie about why he has no money. I have planned a weekend away with my friends this weekend. CG wasnt at all adverse to this, probably because he wont have to make up any more excuses for a little while. I wonder if he believes that I believe the lies?

      On a positive note, I had my first session with a Councillor today. Just a half hour phone appointment. But she was amazing and i feel much better about everything. I will definitely be keeping that support up!

      I think the world is a little less hazy today.

    • #5261
      White Tara

      Hi Logic55, I’m new to these forums and have just read your post. I recently had to end a 10 year relationship with a cg. By the end of it I’m over £100,000 lighter, in therapy, just about have roof over my head and not where I should be in my professional life!! All this due to wanting to ‘support’ my
      CG….however it became toxic…very toxic. I became his enabler through coercion with abuse. Abusive is a word you used in one of your posts and you don’t like to be around him when he’s drinking because of your behaviour. You will never be strong enough to manage the gambling. It manages you and the CG. Your whole life will be even more consumed with gambling, more than it is now. You sound like a rescuer type person, without causing offence do yourself a favour and rescue yourself now. All the love care and support you are giving to gambling, give it back to yourself. Another word that came to mind is grooming/manipulation. He knows which buttons to press hence his use of the child missing you. Everything will always be your fault because you are trying to get him to stop gambling, but the addiction won’t let him. It needs to be fed…constantly. There will always be a hunch, dead cert etc to bet on. If you value your life and you want a healthy future, get out of this relationship as soon as you can. Deep down in your heart you know this is the truth, but your mind and voice are not yet fully aligned with the heart. He himself may not be a monster but the gambling most certainly is. As my therapist said to me: ‘You were never going to think your way out’! I had to take drastic intervention to change my situation. I am getting my life back together, I don’t miss the abuse, I miss parts of him but I know I saved him too by acting with tough love although he may not see it that way. It’s a joy to know that for the first time in ten years my next pay packet; not one penny of it will go towards gambling!!

    • #5262

      Its taken me a few days to reply or post again. For a few reasons really but mainly because my thoughts are a constant battleground at the minute with no two days the same.

      Firstly, White Tara, thank you for your words and I’m sorry that you have had such a stressful time with your CG. I’m glad that you have saved yourself and are taking care of you as your number 1. It took me a little while to reply to you as some of what you said hit home and i found myself reading your post in a million different ways. I totally agree with your comment «He himself may not be a monster but the gambling most certainly is.» It is a monster that I cant wait to rid of, in whatever form that may take.

      I am currently reading up on codependency and this is something which I have been discussing on the helpline and I am looking forward discussing more in counselling.

      Its amazing how coming to the realisation that there is something which I am struggling with, which needs to be explored more, completely washed over me until it was really pointed out to me (and i then went looking for an answer). Maybe I’m a hypocrite. I worry about my CG being in denial of his problems, when it was the same for me too.

      This is the path to making me stronger and I’m excited to rid myself of constant stress and self-destruction and maybe actually manage to be happy. Fingers crossed!

    • #5263

      It was nice to meet you in the group the other day and I was sorry you had to rush off. Much of what you said resonates with me and my own experiences. I have been around in a big circle and look at things with very different eyes now.

      Firstly be aware what you are having a relationship with now is not the man but the addiction, he is in full gambling mode (you don’t need to be constantly gambling to be in the mode). The addiction is telling him not to let you in, not to talk to you about it, that he needs it more than you, if he can provoke an argument then he will have time for his first love — gambling. The man is lost in all of this somewhere, you are not relating to him at all.

      Because of this and the fact he doesn’t even want to talk about his addiction much less tackle it I would personally suggest you at the very least keep him at arms length. You could try perhaps writing to him explaining that moving closer can’t be an option at the moment as you are not prepared to be compromised and responsible for him. That you are happy to continue a relationship with him but you no longer wish to drink or gamble with him/be around him when he is because you feel it is not a positive thing for him. That if things did change in the future that you may consider moving forward but that it is impossible at this time, a least that is how I may of dealt with it in retrospect.

      Drinking by the way can be a huge trigger for gambling the two often go very much hand in hand.

      7 years ago I took my partner in when he got into a lot of problems with his gambling so much so his life was in danger. We went through many stages over many months from minimizing it to finally accepting help to appease me, it was the hardest time of my life. When he gambled again during residential treatment we split up (I left him as I told him I would if he did).

      It was horrendous to get so far and fall at the last hurdle. However he went on with his treatment, it was a struggle for him and for me not to take him back when he emailed, though I did answer them. Anyway to cut a long story short we are now back in touch, I can finally see he is more the man than the addiction. He has to work on it and has not been consistently ‘clean’ over the last 4 years but he is emerging. I love him dearly, we have a wonderful relationship but I would not have him living with me again. My plan is to enjoy the man, I reject the gambling, that his problem, I don’t bring it up there is no need to as long as it doesn’t affect me and as long as there is enough of the man for me to relate to, it is good for both of us. He can continue his recovery and I don’t have the stress and sickening anxiety. It is something i will have to keep checking myself on though. Perhaps one day he will be totally gamble free but I don’t live waiting for that day to come and accept it may not. He will always be a CG regardless recovery never stops even after 20 years clean they still need to remain mindful.

      Sorry to go off on one about my own life, lol, it was to illustrate a point honest! I hope some of it helps, Lily x

    • #5264
      White Tara

      Dear Logic,

      I’m glad that sharing some of my experience with you was useful to you.
      It’s amazing to reflect and hear back the ‘your this, your that messages we project on to others and really we’re talking about ourselves.
      After my first therapy session I reflected back on the gambling in our relationship wondering how the f*** did I get here. Then recently I’ve got into astrology and found gambling in my birth chart. (Of course always bet on the Grand National until the last few years and did the pools coupons in my teens) Well blow me down with a feather…. I did know he was a gambler before he moved in with me and when he moved in I don’t think he was active, certainly not online anyway….at some point he started doing football coupons on a Saturday and I ended up doing it with him for about a year, then we’d play the free online poker games…then at some point it started to turn sour…. when I think back to some of the things I tried to do to help him at various points of the relationship, different strategies including looking at astrology!!!

      Our relationship was co-dependent too with me having attachment issues, so I know there’s things I need to look at too.

      Let your CG be in denial of his problems, let him worry about it, actually you know this already, he’s not worrying at all because the gambling monster won’t let him. Gambling monster’s will to survive is greater…Don’t let your stuff equal out his stuff to put you back on the same footing. You know this already.

      THe only question you need to ask your self and you’ve already done it is this, Do you want gambling in your life? When you ask the question it’s an easy answer it’s either yes or no.

      The road out can take quite a while because of the emotional investment, but you are in a good position because you’re not living with CG and sounds like you have good circle of friends outside of gambling. Have you confided in any of your real life friends what’s going on?

      Apologies if I sound preachy etc I know every relationship is different but the underlying processes and systems are the same.

      Have a good day!

    • #5265

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks you for your message and our discussion on Tuesday. Sorry I couldnt stick around longer. Hopefully we will talk again soon.

      I know I am not in a relationship with the man, but the monster and that’s hard because in reality, I have never really known CG. Everything you say about the addiction is spot on. He wont let me in or talk to me about anything.

      He is switching between so many different things that he wants to get his life back on track…live with me…live on his own…get a car…get a dog…sort things out for his child…it changes almost daily and its impossible to keep up. For now, I have told him that if he want to be with me he needs to make it happen (it is protecting myself because deep down I know he cant follow through on it at the minute). But it is enough to want to see a change in him.

      The last couple of weeks he has been very very distant. And we are going to go from that to spending a lot of time together next week. That worries me as keeping my distance has meant that we are argument free but i dont want to provoke the monster.

      Your story fills me with hope that change is a possibility. But in myself at the minute i am not strong enough to see it through or give an ultimatum as I’m not certain that I can keep strong on it. So, for now, all I can do is fix myself and make myself strong enough to make logical, smart decisions for me. With or without CG.

      Please dont apologise for telling me about your own life. As I discussed with Velvet yesterday, when I first started this i felt the whole «look after you first» mentality was a load of hippy hoo-haa. I see things much differently now and want to be happier, stronger and less stressed.

      Thanks for the help.
      Logic x

    • #5266

      Hi again Logic, I really see so many parallels in your story and mine (if you feel like it read my post ‘shades of grey 7 years on). I knew next to nothing about CGing when I first came across it and I was completely at sea. When I came on the forum people use to say ‘look after you’ and I use to get so frustrated because I wanted to help him and I had no idea what looking after me looks like, I didn’t until well after he was in treatment not really.

      Thing is this addiction sweeps the people around the affected person into its whirlpool and stops them being able to see the way out, the person and the loved one can easily drown in it if they are not careful, it is a horrible place to be, it can sap you of strength and reason.

      A lot of this though is the illusion the addiction creates to take attention away from it’s self. The steps for him are simple (though hard to achieve) 1.admit it, with, 3.keep mindful it could return. Before he can have a proper life let alone a successful relationship this is what needs to happen, all of the other things he talks about doing can not work without these other things happening, it is the way out of the whirlpool for him.

      You don’t have a gambling addiction so you can step out any time, either by ending the relationship or by seeing it how it actually is. Only he can find his exit, try to save him and you will get dragged down with him.

      Your steps are firstly to see things as they are not as he tells you they are, I remember my partner telling me our future was the only thing that mattered to him that he loved me more than anything in the world, that he couldn’t live without me to which I replied if I felt like that about having someone in my future I would be banging down the doors of the treatment centre begging them to let me in so I could be free to have that wonderful life I wanted. Actions speak loader than words, watch as much as listen, don’t be swept up by the words.

      Next you need to accept, I mean really accept, you can not do it for him and while it may not be his choice to gamble it is his choice to deny it’s a problem. Protect your money, do not enable by helping him out with money or put yourself in a position where his lack of money will effect you. He may complain about this and this is where step three comes in, voice what you need from the relationship, I find writing is best as it makes them have to listen and they can look at it again perhaps in a different state of mind. No accusations, no putting down the man, talk about you. ie I need to be able to trust, I need a safe financial future or in my case it was always I need to protect my child from outside issues, I can not invite them in.

      The final step is take a step back, get on with your life and do not step forward again until there are signs of a step forward from them towards their own rescue.

      My CG is the love of my life, he means the world to me but I have learned the only way for us to be together is for us both to take responsibility for our own lives. Seeing me strong helps him stay strong and these days seeing me happy makes him happy and builds his self esteem and makes the chances of him gambling again lessen with each day. So you see by not being always available, by having a life, friends, ambitions you lead the way, you show him what a real life looks like and if things with him break down you have something to fall back on.

      This is only my experience and how I see things but I hope it makes some sense and there is something useful there.

      You are doing better than you think, you are hear, you are listening, you are learning, all part of looking after you 🙂

      Lily x

    • #5267

      Hi Tara,

      I did reply to your message but it has disappeared so I will have to try and rewrite it. Maybe it will have a different perspective today.

      I am definitely similar to you in many ways. And have definitely been guilty of enabling and falling into the trap of joining in, as it was something we could both enjoy (obviously, at the time i didnt realise the impact I was having joining in and dont encourage the gambling anymore.)

      The gambling monster is rearing its head big time at the minute and the more we are creeping towards my CGs favourite pasttime — horses — big events (Cheltenham, Grand National) the more severe the gambling and the lies are getting.

      That’s the thing i struggle with the most, knowing i’m being lied to and not knowing what to say…

      Of course the answer is no i dont want gambling in my life and i will continue to push that. But, I know that this just makes my CG want to hide more.

      For me the road out is long and difficult because I know that I am not emotionally stable enough to deal with not having him in my life anymore. Maybe that’s selfish but the truth is I really love him and it is his selfish actions which are driving me away.

      You will never sound as preachy as some of my friends and, whilst I am better at talking to them now, for a while I wasn’t. They know I’m having counselling and I am talking again.

      For a long time I was hiding what was going on from everyone around me. Mainly, due to CG’s manipulation that he would make it clear that he was unhappy that I was «slagging him off to anyone who would listen». Obviously, I know better than this now and everyday I am learning more and getting stronger.

      I agree that the processes are the same so I’m just trying to take comfort from what others around me say. I know i must be so frustrating to others on here that know i need to step away. It just isnt that easy for me right now…

      Everyday is a battle. Everyday i feel differently about the situation.

    • #5268


      Thanks again for taking the time to write to me. Your messages do me the world of good. I think this reply is a mixture of replying to you and getting stuff off my chest, so sorry if i ramble on about irrelevant stuff.

      I am terrible at looking after myself. I think i am indestructible and that i need to look after everyone else. Trying not to look after CG is tough! The last couple of weeks have shown me just how vulnerable I am.

      I agree with you that its so easy to get sucked in. I am seeing things so much clearer now and can start to see triggers.

      I think my CG is worried that he will soon be rumbled. He has made it clear that he doesnt want to let me in, he wants to do everything himself but that he is incredibly stressed out.

      The addictions at the minute are overwhelming and the lies are unbearable. No — I didnt have a bet this week. *open wallet* there are betting slips clear as day.
      The thing that is making it really hard is facing up to the idea that he is also an alcoholic. Not as an necessity but as a coping mechanism.

      Yesterday, he created an argument from nowhere, about nothing. He had been trying for a little while to get a rise out of me with insults and finally settled on me «sulking» as being the reason. He exploded. No i wasnt allowed in the house, I could just go home. This was the first time i saw the monster for everything that it really was. My CG holding my hand desperate to love me whilst throwing some horrendous insults, pushing me away and just letting out so much anger.

      I could see that what he really wanted was to go inside, be by himself and drink. That’s why he didnt want me there he didnt want me to know.

      Eventually he calmed down and cooked me an incredible dinner. Unfortunately, he definitely snuck in a drink or two when I nipped to the shops. He thinks I dont know. He thinks he got away with it.

      And that is where the difficulty lies with my CG. There is no acceptance or acknowledgement of the problem. Its off limits. There is no conversation to be had.

      Do i pretend that I dont know I’m being lied to over and over again? Do i call him out on the crap? Do i let him fall further into denial and lies to hide everything from me. I completely hear what youre saying about don’t put him down and make it about me, I havent worked out how to do that yet, whilst he is still in denial.

      I have often thought about writing CG a letter. Something permanent where i cant chicken out of what i really want to say, like i have so many times. I’m almost running two parallel lives atm. The one where CG and I pretend like nothing is going on. He lies, i pretend to believe them. And the other where im strengthening myself and putting into place ways and means of escaping the gambling when the time is right for me. I am living a life of denial too. I’m not honest with CG, he isnt honest with me.

      I hope I am doing better than I think. Im really feeling 1 step forward 2 steps back at the minute.

      Sorry for going off on one.

      Logic x

      p.s. I have gone back and read your post. You strength is incredible and its so nice to hear your CG is doing so well. I live in hope!!

    • #5269

      Hi Logic
      I wouldn’t recommend writing your CG a letter – they can be read a million ways and probably never the way you meant the words to be taken. He can screw it up and throw it away or fold it away in a pocket but it still gives him the opportunity to dig it out and re-read it, with his distorted perception, while getting angrier and more determined to believe that you don’t understand him and that gambling is his only answer.
      I believe in letting a CG know that you know they are telling lies, when you are positive that they are – but do it without lots of words that get lost in translation. Something like ‘OK, I hear what you say but don’t think you are fooling me’ and leave it at that; then either get involved in something else or change the subject letting it be clear that as far as you are concerned the subject is firmly closed. Closing the subject when a CG wants to get a reaction is important, in my opinion – not only does it say that he is not succeeding in treating you like an idiot but it takes you out of the argument. Flouncing out and banging the door is a reaction, as is shouting, crying, threatening and pleading, whereas solidly refusing his addiction will hopefully keep you safe.

    • #5270

      I think what you have said above is the exact reason that I have never written a letter to CG (or at least not one that he has ever/will ever see). At the end of the day I didnt think it would achieve what I wanted it to, so for now, I continue my search for my way to be able to express how I feel.

      Yesterday was an eyeopener for me, not only to truly see CG for what he is but that i am starting to get stronger in my dealing of the situation. Maybe i didnt get it quite right as not reacting resulted in an angry explosion from CG (I was in the car so there wasnt really anywhere to escape or distract myself).

      For me, there was a tiny victory in hearing CG wander off muttering «I guess i was pretty harsh with the things I said to you…» Not quite an apology for his unacceptable behaviour, but an acknowledgement that what he did was wrong. Which I cant remember ever happening before.

      Yes, I’ve found those responses to be the best. «if you say so» provides a variety of responses depending on CGs mood. My usual go to is «i’ve heard that’s what you are saying but I dont believe that’s true» usually works quite well but normally lands somewhere with CG concluding that we will just have to agree to disagree.

      He is a very good liar, he got it down to a tee in his last relationship. So it’s often hard to call him out on his bull. I just have to live with the knowledge that I am right and let him live with the denial.

      Thanks for the advice, Velvet! As always, really appreciated! 🙂

    • #5271

      Hi Logic, Velvet makes some really good points about writing to a cg and I can totally see her point, you certainly have to be very careful how you word things so I can see how a letter could be misinterpreted. I do hope things have got a little easier for you and I have been thinking of you and wondering how you are getting on. Lilly x

    • #5272

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks for your message. I thought about writing down how i feel to CG but i know at the minute it won’t register with him.

      This week has been a mixed bag really. We have had gig tickets booked for a while and that required an overnight stay. This made me anxious as our last hotel stay was a disaster on so many ways and ended up with me hundreds of pounds down. So naturally i was worried about this one. He was adament that it was booked but couldn’t show me confirmation of the booking or even name the hotel.

      So i called him out on it. Told him that i knew it had never been booked in the first place. Cue full 24hr strop from CH. him «cancelling» the imaginary hotel.

      When i finally got to talk to him properly we had a good chat and he opened up a little saying that he is really struggling with feeling depressed and stressed. Obviously no mention of the addiction problems but he is getting better at startimg to open up to me so i didn’t want to shut that down by bringing up something i know he is in denial about.

      In the end we went to the gig with a cobbled together plan which was done in the car on the way there. But we actually had a really good time and it was good to see CG happy. And more importantly i felt happy.

      One of the things i struggle with how to address is when CG wants to «treat» me when he wins a bet. Part of me feels like I’m owed something good from all of the stress from this gambling but really i know that isn’t the right answer.

    • #5273

      Hi Logic
      You are answering your own question which is great. If he is buying something with money that you know comes from a ‘gamble’ then in effect you would be validating his behaviour. A polite ‘no thank you – I can’t/will not accept a present made possible by gambling’ would be enough. I think of it in terms of refusing the addiction – not the thought behind the gift, hope that makes sense.
      I’m really pleased you both had a really good time – good times without gambling are important for a CG to have in his memory bank and especially important for your welfare.
      I am a bit erratic at the moment due to bereavement but I do read the forum every day and you are doing well.

    • #5274

      Velvet, I’m so sorry to hear about your bad news and you have been in my thoughts all weekend.

      As is typical of life with a CG, the good time didn’t last long. Currently sitting here by myself after what can only be described as being thrown out of CG’s (we don’t live together, i just had to go home and i am safe) for no real reason at all. Feeling totally rejected, disrespected and used.

      I can’t keep doing this. I need change. I’m broken. I need to step away now.

    • #5275

      Hi Logic, so sorry to hear about you having this rough time. I am sure it felt horrible and I am glad you had your home to go back to and a safe place to reflect. Please remember it is not your fault or any reflection on you. I can’t second guess his reasons but I can say that stating arguments in order to gain the time/space/excuse to gamble is something that does happen. It could be a multitude of reasons but I can almost guarantee you it had nothing to do with anything you have said or done. Most gamblers have very low self esteem and are fully aware they are not a good proposition for a relationship. He may feel he is not good enough or that it is better you see the ‘real him’ now before its too late.

      Hopefully you have had time to gather your thoughts and recover. As where you go from here it is up to you but it is a tough one without clear communication which is next to impossible with a gambler in denial. Try to take some time for you doing something you enjoy enough to not be constantly thinking about your cg.

      Sorry I couldn’t get back to you before, lily x

    • #5276

      Hi Velvet I hope Logic doesn’t mind me popping on her thread to say I am so sorry for your loss and I will try to get on here a little more to offer support whilst you are coming to terms with things. Lily x

    • #5277

      Sorry Lily that I have not been in touch sooner and thank you for taking the time to reply.

      After my last message i spent the rest of the night upset and not sleeping and eventually manifested in making myself ill enough that I was not in work for a couple of days.

      Obviously, I haven’t been doing enough to look after myself and if I’m not looking after myself then that needs to be my priority.

      As a result of being ill and generally feeling rubbish, a lot of my own self-doubt and worry has kicked in. There hasnt even been time to worry too much about CG but I’ve found myself doing the worst thing and bringing him down with me.

      I am focusing on me this week. Looking after me. Taking positive steps for me. and working towards getting my head back in the right place!!

      CG has been quite argumentative this weekend but its something i find really hard to deal with as I can see he doesnt want to be throwing the tantrums and arguments that he does but he cant stop himself. Starting to see a correlation between payday when he gets his fix and the weekend, which is half way away from payday and when I am most around him and, therefore, harder for him to gamble/when he has ran out of money, which leads to him wanting to argue.

      The world of excuses for where his money went this week was a new level of BS, even by CG’s standards. So frustrating!!

      Sorry that this isnt a more positive message. Hopefully, by the end of this week, the positivity will be flowing!!!

    • #5278

      Hi Logic, It is nice to see you posting but please remember your post is for you so post when you need to (although of course once people comment on a post they do look to see how people are doing and it is always good to hear from the original contributor).

      It sounds like you hit a real low and have come out of it understanding that you need to protect yourself a little better. As for ‘bringing your partner down with you’ if you are not shouting at him or making personal remarks or deliberately making him feel guilty then his moods are just that ‘his’. CG often go through many low times and we don’t always get to know the full reason for them, so much is hidden, it’s not your fault or responsibility. As you have so astutely observed though there can be a patten to these moods (there was a post up the other day about this very subject).

      You are in a difficult position because your cg is in denial and honestly there is not much you can do in this situation except not be party to the addiction (ie gambling with them, accepting gifts from a win or lending or giving money) which I believe you are already doing.

      If it is difficult to be around him at these argumentative periods you could always keep the visits shorter to protect yourself a little or spend some of your time together engaged in an activity either with or without him by way of a detraction and to break things up.

      He is a fortunate man to have such a caring and tolerant partner whilst he is not willing to look at his own problems. It is vital you have time for you whether this be spending time with friends or family or engaging in a passion or hobby, this is what keeps us sane and balanced, it is impossible to keep balanced when your life becomes all about the addiction.

      Please don’t apologize about a post not being positive enough, the forum is here for you in good times and bad and to help you get your own thoughts clear, we are all here to support each other.

      Take care of yourself, Lily x

    • #5279

      I havent posted for a little while as I have been focusing on me. Managed to fall down the stairs and break my foot so i’m very much out of action and really has opened my eyes as to how much I can only look after myself.

      CG has been very frustrating. Initially, no help with getting to hospital, no checking I was okay and just the excuses that he would obviously be there if he could, but its too hard for him to get to me. However, even when he was able to get to me, he didnt come. Just so frustrating that, when I really do need him, he just wasnt present. it was so easy for him to detach himself from what was happening with me.

      I know that that is my own issue and that he just isnt capable of offering me what I need when I am struggling.

      Once i was in front of him though and he has to face up that i needed help, he was amazing. checking on what i need, breakfast in bed. taking on extra driving so i dont have to do it. he was amazing, why couldnt he just do that from day 1 instead of fighting against me!?

      This week is filling me with dread. Cheltenham festival ending with a lovely double whammy on Friday of Cheltenham Gold Cup and Paddy’s day 🙁 I need CG as I want to visit my mum for her birthday and he knows this and ive set out clearly what I need. He has already said that the only way he will be sober is because of his son’s karate class that evening and he cant turn up to that drunk. so making it nice and clear that if he does stay out of the pub, he wont be doing it for my benefit….

      Just dont know the best way to handle this week, apart from keep my distance…

    • #5280

      I havent responded earlier because of the reasons below.

      Yes, I did hit a low and that crept into the last couple of weeks of additional boredom of not being able to do much more than sit around and look at my foot.

      Last week, I really changed my mood and went back to how I would normally treat a SO. My logic, I can either let myself be pulled down back into the gambling spiral, where we are both in terrible moods and taking it out on each other. or i can rise above it and hope that CG can rise above it too.

      And he did, the last few days/weeks have been great. he has wanted to see me more and even suggested that I saw him last week on payday. which was a big deal as i cant remember if there has been a single pay day this year where he hasnt gone off radar.

      Yeah it is really difficult as long term its harder and harder to see how we would have a future together, even though I know it is what he desperately wants. He just has too much enablement around him to ever hit rock bottom.

      I have been keeping visits shorter. Yesterday was very interesting as his village suffered from internet outage and he had no tv/internet all weekend. As i cant do anything, adding no tv/internet to that was driving me crazy and we were both getting on each others nerves. So I left and went back to the 21st century! usually, he would have some big kick off to justify why i had to leave. but he was super affectionate and waited to wave me off. Very unusual for my CG.

      This week is going to be tough. All i can do is distract myself. somehow. Maybe.

    • #5281

      Hi Logic, I am really sorry to hear about your foot and that your partner didn’t come when you needed him. It must of been a really difficult time for you. What I really want to say to you or should I say what I would of needed to hear in your position is it is no reflection on you as a person, it is not because you are unloveable or don’t deserve to be cared for, it is not personal (although I know it must of felt personal). Your partner is being lead by addiction first, first before love, before family, before self care — the addiction whispers in his ear and says ‘just stay here have this bet, you can go when you have won some money, if you go now you will miss out on the big win, if you see her now you will have to take care of her and miss out on this cash that could make things better when you go, just stay for a little while.’ Addiction is a manipulative mistress and when it is not recognized or acknowledged by the CG it controls their every move.

      It is not that it is easy for him to detach himself from you it is that it is impossible to detach himself from gambling, meaning there is little room for any thing else. He wouldn’t of had the room in his head to empathize or even take in what was happening to you but once he saw you it briefly brought him back to himself by the sound of it.

      It sounds like you have learnt this yourself the hard way and about the reason many of us on here will bang on about taking care of yourself first and foremost. Being distracted by such a massive and scary thing as having someone with an addiction in your life can also have a detrimental effect on us and our lives, it can make us distracted, careless, tired and depressed, this can also cause us to make mistakes and make problems for ourselves so self care is vital for us to hold onto ourselves and not to become another victim of compulsive gambling by proxy.

      You have reminded me that I will have to be flexible this weekend with my son who’s father is a CG in denial and will be in no fit state to care for his son either but as you see I needed to be reminded as it is not something at the fore front of my mind, I probably would of remembered as soon as I got a text with an excuse as to why he couldn’t see his son this weekend. Gambling still affects my life, I have my ex (my son’s dad) who is a gambler of 35 years in denial and my parnter who is a CG in recovery so gambling has had a massive affect on me over the last 20 years however I am at a point now where I do not allow it to be my life. I also learnt this the hard way so I do understand how difficult it is. My partner is there for me now, I see him as he is not as the addiction makes him but it was a long road with treatment and a separation for us both to learn to about ourselves and it is on going, there is no cure as such, my partner will always be a CG in recovery abstaining from gambling although many do manage this for the rest of their lives. My sons father I am sad to say will probably never change, denial is something you can not force someone out of.

      I live my life now by living in the moment and enjoying each day and worrying about things when/if they happen. I fill my time with doing the things I love like pottering around in the garden or helping my sister with the horses, taking my son to places or visiting friends. The trick is to learn to be fully present when doing these things and not having half a mind on what your CG is up to, this time and these pleasures give me the energy and strength to deal with things when/if they happen not be constantly running through what might happen in my head. You are responsible for you not for their lives and their addiction and there is very little you can do for a gambler in denial except refuse to be part of it.

      Is there friends or family you could go and stay with this weekend? Spending time being cared for and appreciated would be so much more healthy for you than sitting at home with a broken foot wondering what your partner might be up to and the truth is no matter how much you worry that will not change the outcome for good or bad.

      Take care of you, you deserve it, Lily x

    • #5282

      Hi Logic
      Lily has given you such a great reply that I can add very little apart from maybe pointing out a little word that my CG told me about a long time ago.
      You say you ‘need’ your CG to take you to your mother and you have set out clearly what you ‘need’. I was told by my CG that when his addiction had been active, what I needed was not what he needed. My ‘need’ was for him to stop gambling and live a decent, honest, caring life but his ‘need’ was to gamble.
      I believe you know the right thing to do but the hard bit is doing it and although I really do understand the dilemma I suggest that somehow, some way you go to see your mother without any help from someone whose sober support is dependent on a karate class.
      I hope your foot mends soon. Injury makes us feel vulnerable and perhaps more in need than usual but if you had never met your partner how would you have got to see your mother?
      Keep posting

    • #5283

      Thank you both Lily and Velvet for your considered replies.

      Lily, I know you are right and after spending a long while upset that i wasnt worth enough, I remembered that it isnt that, its that he physically cannot empathise with me. i spent a long time talking to my counselor about it and i have it straight in my head that he just cant deal with it all and the gambling does and will come first.

      I am definitely guilty of all of those traits you described, essentially leading to not looking after myself. i’m working hard every day to get better at that. and stepping away yesterday from a situation i didnt want to be in was a HUGE step for me and probably not something I would have done before.

      As far as doing things for me goes, I will, in a few weeks be thousands of miles away from CG on a girls trip where I intend on being present. I know a full two weeks of not worrying will be incredibly difficult for me. Plus I will be in Vegas, which isnt a problem for me but I’m sure will affect CG in someway.

      Velvet, I do have a very long and annoying contingency plan in place for getting me back to my parents (I cant drive myself as its my right foot that is broken). After the first week of the break, and what happened in my post, i realised that i cant rely on him as i would expect with a non-gambling partner.

      I think CG is as desperate for the break to visit my parents as I am and seems concerned that he will be left to his own devices on saturday morning when I am off getting my hair cut (doing things for me!).

      I have given him a bit of a bad rep, he has rearranged his time with his little boy to come with me and does recognise that it is important to me.

      However, I’m well aware that it will probably be a «favour» that he will want cashing back in at some point.

      Yes, my foot did lead me to feeling very vulnerable and isolated. but once i changed my attitude and stopped feeling sorry for myself everything got a bit easier.

      I think I have come back to posting at exactly the right time as CGs home life is about to get turned upside down. Which really isnt needed during this week *sigh*.
      I’ll update when everything is more under control.

      Thanks again. Your responses just give me so much clarity on my situation.

    • #5284

      Hi Logic, please don’t beat yourself up. When I first came on here I didn’t even know what looking after yourself meant and it has taken me years to fully understand it!

      I am glad you are going on holiday but I need to ask, will you be gambling in Vagas? It may not be a problem for you but doesn’t it send out conflicting messages to a gambler in denial? I have never had any interest in gambling so this really isn’t an issue for me but I know it is something my CG has struggled with when gambling (but not addicted) friends have talked to him about betting. It brings it back into a socially acceptable ‘hobby’ or pass time’ which is especially dangerous for a gambler in denial. I would be very careful how you present this to your partner. One rule for one etc.

      I am glad you have a counselor (this shows great self care). I am seeing one too at the moment and he has talked to me in length about my own problems with relationships and how I chose unsuitable men to avoid them getting too emotionally close due to my trust issues. He has pointed out how now my partner is in recovery and come back at a point I am also working on my issues means I have in inadvertently ‘let him in’ and it has become the closest relationship I have ever had and assuming he maintains his gamble free life also the healthiest! Looking at the reasons we start and maintain relationships with people who are emotionally unavailable is an important step for us too and can really help move things forward in the most suitable direction.

      You are obviously a bright caring woman and I am sure you will find the answers you are looking for in time if you allow yourself the space to do so.

      Take care Lily x

    • #5285

      Hi Lily,

      Yes, I am terrible at it. I know we have discussed it before but I find it so difficult to truly look after myself. I always put others first, now i am realising, to a fault.

      With regards to Vegas, yes I will gamble and I completely agree that to do that sends horrendous mixed messages and levels of hypocrisy. The only conversation I have had with CG about it he just said «wow..I would be dangerous if i was let loose in vegas.»

      However, I am not an addict. I know that it is just a way of throwing away $$$. I’m not chasing a win. I know I will lose and will waste $xx doing it. And that is exactly what I told CG about it. For me its a «when in Rome» thing. And even if I did abstain, for CG Vegas = gambling. It would make no difference what I was actually doing there (we are doing plenty of non-gambling related things) but im sure we will all throw a few dollars on red/black, just to say we did it.

      Everything sounds so positive with your partner ( I was just reading your thread) and I’m glad you have become so close and your are both now so emotionally available to fully love each other. I accept that I have my own issues too and I’m working towards them. I can only hope that if I’m working towards being in a better place, CG will want that for himself too.

      Thanks for replying 🙂 x

    • #5286

      HI Logic,
      Thanks for reading my thread. Yes, things are good at the moment between my CG and I, in many ways it is a bit of a fairytale but like all good stories it has been hard fought and gruesome at times, has required courage, determination and has tested us to our limits at times, the 7 years we spent apart is testament to this.

      Our story is different to yours because my partner told me when we first met (working holiday romance) 17 years ago he was a CG, he has never lied to me about having a problem although he has lied to me about when he has gambled. He pushed me away at first trying to keep me safe but I think it was the fact my life was so different and my complete lack of interest in gambling that kept bringing him back to me, I was a safe haven. He has turned to me when things have gone wrong and he has feared for his life, I have spoken to his mother about his problem and been a go between for them, I convinced him to go into therapy and I left him as I said I would if he gambled again. In the end though stopping gambling had to be his choice and using his will, I couldn’t do it for him.

      Gamblers tend to surround themselves with other gamblers or addicts to enable there situation, to keep their secrets, they often have few real friends and so I think it can be hard to see life as being any different. I personally believe that there are no half measures, you need to reject gambling if you want to reject it in someone else but then again as I say I don’t even buy a lottery ticket and the only reason I’d go into a bookies would be to give them a piece of my mind! I hate gambling and all it represents, after all it has come between me and the love of my life and almost destroyed him to boot!

      I was in no way suggesting you are an addict btw I was simply saying how it might look to him because he is in denial he will be looking for reasons to justify his own behavior and you gambling even as a one off is a perfect excuse. Of course this is not your problem, it’s his and you should be ale to go on holiday with the girls and have a bit of fun but if you are doing that intending to continue to be with your cg and wishing him to change his ways you need to be aware that it might cause more problems.

      They say you can’t chose who you fall in love with but you can chose what you want out of life (and what you don’t want) and sometimes it is necessary to let people go in order to move forward and have the life you want. In my case the only thing bad in my relationship was the addiction, my partner and I are best friends as well as lovers and he means the world to be. It broke my heart to call it a day when I did but as the non addict in the relationship I had to have the honest and consistent approach stick to my word and my principles in order to not become embroiled and get myself dragged down too as this would of helped neither of us.

      It’s easy to enable and much harder not too, we all want to be loved, we all want to make the other person happy. Having to say no to giving my cg money when I managed it for a while was really hard and he manipulated me in many ways to try and get it but loving someone is about saying no when needed as much as saying yes, it is about hard truths being told and hard choices being made above all it is as much about being true to yourself as anything else. I would rather see my partner gamble free and happy, than with me and not, if that was what it took.

      Being a good example by being a fully rounded person and practicing what you preach is so helpful when trying to navigate through this maze which is having a relationship with a cg ‘As you said ‘I can only hope that if I’m working towards being in a better place, CG will want that for himself too.’ Everyone’s story has a potential for a happy ending although it is not always the ending you expect! Lily x

    • #5287

      Hi Lily,

      I know the hard work and pain that has it has taken to be able to find your happiness with your partner and fills me with hope that there are ways to beat this horrible addiction.

      Yes, our situations are so different. I was so naive to addiction before I met CG, I enabled him, I embraced his gambling as I didnt see it as more than one of those things that guys go, that I just didnt get. I wasnt introduced to his family for a long time (because he is ashamed of where he comes from, he has a lot of insecurities about who he is and his background) so I couldnt see the problems that were there.

      I have changed my behaviour as i learn and i learn something new pretty much daily. Before I met CG, I couldnt even tell you where my nearest bookies was, now I see them everywhere and am shocked about the sheer amount of advertising there is in relation to gambling, particularly in comparison to other addictions. But that is another rant.

      I agree, I hate how much gambling can ruin lives and whilst I do refuse to gamblewith CG now, I have in the past and I will in Vegas. And even if I didnt, CG would assume that I am. I thought about it for a long time, and the best thing I can do is be honest about what I have done and that I have lost money and reconfirm my belief that gambling is a mugs game. It creates losers and the house always wins. Its another example of the loss caused by gambling, not the joining in of CGs favourite past time.

      Oh and I completely agree, CG surrounds himself with his fellow gamblers, he has fb groups sharing tips constantly, his dad, his brother, his work colleagues, he is surrounded constantly by gambling. his real friends he sees once in a blue moon.I am trying now to be a safe haven for him, but it a fine line to tread with someone in denial.

      I understand what you are saying about taking the control of the situation and I am working towards putting myself in to a position to do that. Sadly, if he doesnt want to teke positive steps, the relationship wont move in a positive direction and then what is left? I am dealing with my own issues and hopefully, that will make stronger in being able to look after myself.

      CG is talking about giving me control of his bank account, I’m not sure in what capacity or how to deal with this so any advice would be appreciated if you have done this before with your partner. The one condition I had was that I didnt want him transferring money into my account. I dont want to be accused of trying to steal his money or any of that manipulative bs so the only way I would agree would be to have control of his account/card. Im dubious about if it would work or even if he would give me enough control that it actually means i’m helping him.

      I am trying my hardest to better myself as I know that CG craves that better life. Im hoping that if he can be present at the weekend, getting a break from his family and get some time with my functioning family, may do him some good. Things arent good for him at home at the minute. Thanks for listening x

    • #5288

      Hi Logic, what a great post, I can see you have really thought things out and you are taking the steps you need to protect yourself and learn about what you are up against.

      I am not sure how old your partner is or how long he has had the problem, it tends to be an escalating problems so the longer it has been going on the more ingrained it becomes, the bigger the losses, the more desperate the actions to get money. My CG had a long term addiction and had been to prison more than once before I met him and had his life threatened more than once for debts too. He attempted for many, many years to fight the addiction but it has only been in recent years he has started to really get any kind of handle on it and this is the first time I really feel he has changed his attitude sufficiently for me to believe he really can beat it.

      It is great that your CG has asked you to handle the money, it shows he does want to change. It is something you need to think about hard, if you have a long term relationship with him and end up moving in together as you have mentioned you may well always have to manage the money long term.

      Money to a gambler is like drugs to a drug addict or cigarettes to a smoker, it is the means to feed the addiction. It needs to keep away from them, My CG has his boss keep his wages now aside from a small weekly budget and this has been a massive part of his recovery. He can get the other money when he needs it but has to have a 24 hour cooling off period and a good reason before his boss will give it to him. He has told everyone he knows that if he comes to them wanting money in a hurry whatever emergency he comes up with it will really be for gambling and not to hand it over. It is a relief not to have to care for his money at the moment, although in the future I may have to take the reins again but that would be further into recovery so hopefully I wouldn’t have the constant requests for it as I did before.

      My advice would be to sit down and work out a budget with him, ideally paying as many things as possible direct so he doesn’t have the cash, limit cash to what he really needs ie bus fairs or petrol, coffee money etc and give it to him daily rather than weekly. It can cause a strain in the relationship because it shifts the power to you which some males find rather hard from a partner plus he may try to get money for things outside of budget which can be very stressful and it can feel like a real responsibility ie if you get it wrong you feel to blame. Best explained to him in advance that you will not be doing this and the reasons why. I would suggest you open a separate account ideally in your name for him to put the money in that he has no cards too or else he puts the money in your account and you transfer a small budget into his each day/week. Never bail him out if he messes up, that includes things like paying for food or petrol if he blows his budget, if he know you will do this he always has that option.

      No one would chose this life for themselves, it is a horrible, stressful and lonely place to be I am sure but it is so hard to get out of the trap and he will need some kind of help. Forgive me if you have answered this before but does he have any specialist support such as GA? If he is seriously wanting to get on top of it I can highly recommend the Gordon moody residential program, it is hard for them to be away for so long but it could be a good transitional step for him if there was a place and he was willing. It be possible for him to move from his family home to there and do the work before moving in with you if that is still the plan. Of course there would be no point in that unless he was really committed to it and places are always in short supply.

      It is a big step and a huge commitment to support a CG through to recovery and not something to be taken lightly. You need to be sure of how you really feel about that person and that the only issues in the relationship are that gambling. You also need to be sure who you are and be prepared not only to grow and change but accept through recovery they will also change and grow. Most of all you have to be fully aware that you can’t do it for them, that they may not be ready to put themselves through recovery, that they may never be ready.

      Lastly remember it his life is his life and you are only responsible for your life. Sure you can help and support him as a partner but don’t make his ups and downs your ups and downs, take care of your life and what you need day to day and in the longer term.

      Hope some of this is useful/makes sense Lily x

    • #5289

      Wow, Lily. Everytime you reply i feel like things are so much clearer.

      My CG is about to turn 30, i think he has gambled for all of his adult life and is leaned behaviour from his dad and hi s older brother. As for how long he has had a problem or how deep the problem is, its something that has come before me but as he is in denial its not something i know the details of. i know he has had problems as a result of pay day loans, credit cards etc. but he attributes all of that to the struggle of having a child at an age when he wasnt really ready. I’m under no illusion that they are problems caused from the gambling but shows the level of his denial.

      The handling of money is something i have distanced myself from for a long time. i have slowed the idea of living together because he needs to sort himself out first. we had a conversation a couple of weeks ago about how he has given up on looking after himself and moving forwards and that is why he stuck in his situation. That is what is leading towards him wanting me to look after his finances.

      he does have a thrift in work, where his employer keeps part of his wages. most of the guys he works with use it for Christmas presents and holidays. he has already spent that money more times over in his head than i care to think about.

      All of that advice is really useful, and somethings i hadnt considered before so I’m glad I asked. My reasoning to do it from a second account of his it to keep the transparency. I can easily justify the direct debits and the money going in/out and its not «me stopping him getting his money» or taking his money off him, it is his his money, in his account that he is not able to access.

      He is massively in denial about his gambling addictions. He looks to his dad and his older brother, who really cant function in a world outside of their own head and because he «isnt as bad as them» i dont think he sees his problems in the same way. when we have been able to talk before about the addicition, which is usually a very small window, i remember a conversation where i said that i didnt want to see him turn into his dad/brother and he said he loved me so much just for saying that about him and seeing something in him worth saving. Thats probably as close as I have gotten to him recognising that there is a problem.

      As regards to any kind of professional support, he isnt anywhere near hitting rock bottom, he is pretty well protected by enablers around him, so to get him to go to a rehab facility would never be something he would consider at this stage. 1. as he doesnt recognise there is a problem 2. he wouldnt agree to not see his child for that long. Usual therapy he «doesnt believe in» he sees it as someone telling you how to think and judging him etc. GA meetings, i think it would be similar to his views on his dad/brother — why am i here? I’m not as bad as these guys.

      I think he would benefit most from CBT but he needs to want to accept that help and, currently, he doesnt want the help.

      I wouldnt be here on this site or still with him if i couldnt see the incredible person he is behind the horrible veil of addiction. As as long as I see more of him than i do of the gambler then i know there is hope. The problem is the longer he suppresses for and the longer he goes untreated, the more likely he will be to go the same way as his family members and I will have lost him forever.

      Your messages are always useful and are very clear in relation to my garbled mess of outpouring of thoughts! Thanks once again for the support x

    • #5290

      Hi Logic, my partner was 33 when I first met him (17 years ago)and and been gambling since his mid teens and already up to his neck in problems. He admitted his problems but had no real desire to change and I think pushing me away was in equal parts trying to protect me and leaving the door open for him to gamble.

      You partner may be verbally in denial but the fact he is asking you to care for his money is an admission and through is family he is aware of where it might lead. Managing money though is not solving the problem, it a management strategy, you can only hope by being forced to look at his finances more closely he has to face the extent of the problem and will eventually agree to help. My partner was very resistant to getting help even after saying he wanted to stop for the same ‘reasons’ your partner has sited. I insisted he got help if he wanted to continue the relationship but he didn’t fully engage with program until after we split up about half way through treatment and has only gradually started using the tools they gave him there effectively recently. The money management he now has and the fact it is tied to his work (and his boss is no push over) has been the key to his recent change in attitude however and has helped him break the cycle.

      I think you are very wise to put off moving in together, it would be good if he could get a place away from his family under the circumstances though.

      I am sure I don’t need to tell you that the drink/gamble situation is not a good one and far more difficult to give up gambling when your will power and decision making abilities are clouded by drink or drugs. No surprise though that they often go hand in hand.

      I have to go now but great to see you posting and reading and learning, knowledge is our best tool against this horrible addiction.

      Keep up the good work, Lily x

    • #5291

      HI Lily,

      Thanks for your post. CG has been quite non-committal with regards to the details of what he actually wants me to do with his money. We have been currently dealing with a «lost» wallet which conveniently turned back up just before the races this week.

      I think the main reason he wants me to have his money is just that, he needs a place away from his family. I have always said he has to do that before I would consider living with him (in reality, he needs to struggle with paying bills and budgeting and pain we ALL have to go through to get our bills paid regularly and in full and on time).

      Just to explain the ridiculousness of my CG’s denial of addiction, all afternoon he has been sat in the pub watching Cheltenham IN HIS GYM KIT!! so his sound mind was going to the gym. This makes him happy, improves his mood, gives him focus. The gambling monster has had him sat in the pub all day watching racing.

      He has messaged me though asking if i want to see him tonight. we arranged a date night earlier in the week, but with the distractions of racing, i thought it would go straight out of the window (better things to spend money on than me). So either he has had a good day on his bets or, well i cant really think of the other option…

      So hard to decide whether to meet him or not…

    • #5292

      Hi Logic, did you meet him in the end? Chances are somewhere in the back of his mind he knew he would end up watching/betting on the races but put his gym kit on to give him an alternative reason for leaving the house.

      With no real signs of a commitment to seriously acknowledging his problem or taking steps toward change it is really difficult to see where you go from here.

      When he ‘lost’ his wallet did you bail him out? Is it possible he had already gambled the money it and ‘lost’ it until he could get money elsewhere?

      For a CG there really is no such thing as a good day at the bookies, they will normally stay there until they have spent every penny they have regardless of any ‘winnings’ they may of had along the way.

      If you did met him I hope it was ok, I always found it very hard to relate to my CG when he was in gambling mode ie disengaged with quite a hard edge.

      Try not to get sucked in too much and keep us updated, Lily x

    • #5293

      Hi Lily,

      He has always said from the start that he was going to have a bet on Cheltenham. There was never going to be much to prevent that. I think the mess his brother is currently in is stemming how bad my CG is and, if I’m honest, I was actually surprised he was functioning enough to want to see me on pay day in the middle of Cheltenham. There are other times when that definitely wouldn’t have happened.

      However, i know he is being dishonest about how much he has been betting. Ive seen some of the betting slips of what he lost and its not what he told me, which is disappointing but not unexpected.

      I decided to see him and we went out for dinner. The WHOLE way there he was talking about Cheltenham. I had purposely not looked at any results so that I had no idea what he was talking about. Eventually, he recognised he was boring me talking about it and changed the topic.

      Totally, we had a talk about what is going on with his brother at the minute, it was interesting to see it from CG’s perspective. That woke me up a little bit. But no there is no commitment from him and it is hard to see where there is a future. I’m moving myself forward in positive ways and that’s all I’m really in control of doing at the minute.

      No, I didnt bail him out when he lost his wallet. That mistake was made a long time ago and he knows better than to come to me asking for money. Strangely, although he «lost» his wallet. He didnt lose his bank card, so i’m not sure what the purpose of the «lost» wallet was.

      I know there’s no such thing as a good day at the bookies, I meant a day when he had come away with a «win». That’s why I was concerned about meeting him. I thought that if he had had a win, dinner would be paid for with the money from that. He had obviously had losses all day though as there was a nice empty wallet.

      He was actually on quite good form at dinner. He disappeared upstairs for a while when his pay went in, which he also did last week. And me reminding him that he needed to give me some money to go towards something we had agreed to split paying for resulted in a strop, a big charade about his internet banking and then going to the cash machine to make sure i got that money.

      I got the money in the end, I know months ago I would have fallen for a world of lies, excuses and fake promises.

      It’s hard not to get sucked in. I’m just staying really disengaged from the gambling and Cheltenham in general. Friday is the next big hurdle as from what he was saying yesterday, he is intending on having some big bets then.

      Just looking after me x

    • #5294

      Hi Logic
      I like your final sentence best but what are you doing to look after you?
      Friday might be his next hurdle but do you have plans for Friday and at the weekend that please you? Are you waiting to see or hear what happens in his life to decide what you will do or are you planning your own life to please yourself?
      Speak soon

    • #5295

      Hi velvet,

      good to hear from you 🙂

      I’m filling my time with a lot more things that just concern me, rather than worrying about what CG is doing. Its two weeks until I go away so there is lots of prep to do for that, which is keeping me busy. And I’m making lots more positive plans with friends, who are all being much more supportive and that’s great.

      I know I’m not getting everything right but this is a tough week for me with the distractions and encouragement of Cheltenham for my CG. I’m trying to keep calm and just be a positive influence for him.

      Oh yes, definitely. It is my mum’s birthday today and tomorrow I am travelling 130miles to visit her and my family, who I havent seen since Christmas. So it is a very me-focused weekend.

      The easiest, cheapest and most convenient way to do this is in the car, which is why I have recruited CG into helping with the driving, especially with my out of action foot. I can travel on the train but its more than double the price and will take longer and obviously requires more walking.

      Either way, I will be at home with my family. I hope with CG as he has been super supportive since the initial letting me down when I first got injured, but I will keep you posted.

    • #5296

      Hi Logic,
      In his current situation/mindset your part worst case scenario, he gambles everything or maybe more than everything (ie money he doesn’t have). He gets into financial problem (he likely already in some), its a downward spiral eventually he hits rock bottom and starts to really feel the effects of the gambling perhaps he admits he has a problem and starts to work on it, if he is going to this is the stage he will. What will you affect is you worrying going to have on this? The answer is none at all, what is the affect of you supporting going to have on him? Perhaps prolonging the process.

      I am sorry to be so blunt but all you can do is look after you, your life, your finances, your family, your own happiness and stop taking responsibility for his. If I was you I would find something to really occupy me for the rest of the week and make alternative arrangements for the travel to your Mum’s. I know it is difficult to take this approach but you need to protect your own state of mind, lily x

    • #5297

      Hi Lily,

      Tough love is what gets through to me the best, I guess. So no need to apologise, even if i don’t really like the outcome(!)

      Today is the day I have lost him. Its post pay day and he knows he cant go big tomorrow. By the looks of his social media, he has had a big win (not that im checking up on him, it crossed my radar) but I’m keeping my distance and keeping my mind occupied with other things. It wont last him long.

      I am taking huge steps to look after myself better and put myself first, more than most people know, but the biggest step of all is a medium length plan and wont fall into place straightaway.

      I’ll see what I can do. The train option isnt something I can afford. Its difficult….Feels kinda cutting my nose off to spite my face.

    • #5298

      Hi Logic,
      I only say make your own way because he may let you down or there maybe stresses etc associated with him giving a lift while in fall blown gambling mode. It helps reduce stress if you now your plans aren’t reliant on a cg at these times.

      You are in a very difficult and emotionally draining situation so be extra kind to yourself. Tomorrow is another day, things change all the time, the only thing for certain is if you keep growing and changing things will look very different to you in a years time. Its hard to see the wood for the trees when you are up to your neck in worry about someone elses gambling. Step back, breath, move forward. Lily x

    • #5299

      I completely understand what you are saying and i know i can’t trust him or rely on him in full gamling mode. I know that i can do it on my own. I would just prefer not to as its goIng to be very expensive for me.

      As i suspected, CG gambled big, won big and lost big. I don’t trust the number he is giving me and is obviously lying and feeling very sorry for himself. A little while ago i would have been really worried about him and mothered him and wanted to make it better. This time it hasnt touched me. He is messaging me telling me how bored he is with life. I told him to take his own advice that he gave to his brother earlier in the week and said goodnight.

      He will wallow for the rest of the night and probably blow whatever is left tomorrow.

      I on the other hand have had a really nice non-gambling night and really taken care of myself and it feels great! So nice not to be weighed down by the gambling monster!

      Every day is a new day and this weekend is a me indulgent weekend. Nothing is going to change that. Not Even the gambling monster.

      Thanks so much for your continued support lily. Is so good to have someone to talk to x

    • #5300

      Hi Logic,
      It’s good to hear you are taking care of you. I hope you have a lovely weekend and all goes smoothly with getting to your Mum’s house.

      ‘See’ you when you get back and don’t hesitate to post if anything changes or you are worried in the meantime. There is always someone hear to listen, this forum was a godsend for me when I needed it and always happy to support others if I can now things have moved on for me., just glad it has been of some use to you! Enjoy your time away, Lily x

    • #5301

      Hi Lily,

      I see you are working hard on the forums at the minute. Thought it was worth an update.

      Ahhh Friday. Up until 1.30 everything was running smoothly…ish.

      Thursday had been CG’s big blow out. All of the wages were gone. Apparently he got up to around £800 in cash in his wallet. That all went on roulette. Big promises that he has £1500 coming in from his online account (believe that if you will).

      After a nothing morning from CG, suddenly started getting very uplifting messages from CG, the excitement of the gamble was kicking in. Right on the stroke of the first race at cheltenham i got a message about how i made him feel like scum and he wasnt coming. I reacted. overcompensating and desperately trying to reassure (damn you codependency).

      Then nothing.

      Then the horse I knew he was going to back big fell. More messages about how i made him feel worthless. This time a more sensible approach from me. I replied saying that I was too busy at work to reply properly but I would see him where we had arranged to meet after work.

      I prepared myself for getting the train. But he was there. looking the worst for wear but he was present. Obviously with no money and a world of excuses.

      My weekend with my family was lovely. He was engaged and nice with them. I know forced family events arent comfortable for addicts so i appreciated the effort. And he did make a lot of effort. but the lack of money bothered me. having to watch him look sheepish that he couldnt pay for a round of drinks, us being restricted in what we did during the rest of the weekend. I find it so tough not to bail him out and pay in those situations.

      As I said, it was a very me focused weekend and i think that I will be moving closer to my parents for work and this wont be something that CG will be able to do, so i think this may be as far as our relationship goes. There’s only so long I can wait for something more from him and that isnt going to change, so i have to do what is best for me, even though it would break my heart, perhaps it is for the best.

      A lot of emotions going around at the minute. A lot of worry about the future and I can feel the codependency and anxiety rearing its ugly head again.

      Gosh dating a gambler is hard… logic x

    • #5302

      Hi Logic,
      It was good to read your update, I have been wondering how the weekend went for you. It sounds like a stressful build up to it.

      I have read with interest your regular referrals to codependency and TBH it is something I have only had a surface understanding of so I have been doing a bit more research into it. Turns out I am a prime candidate for it and indeed reading the sign and symptoms have been in codependent relationships for most of my life. This in turn made me realise that the biggest thing to change in my current relationship was me! Obviously my partners addiction therapy process also gave him the tool to work through his own issues and root of his gambling which also played its part but fundamentally seeing things through different eyes changes everything regardless of your partners path. Things can not remain the same when one player or more player in the story has changed their role. It is the same with you and your partner. You have no control or power to change him and neither is it right for you to try, its up to him, he has to do it for himself but you can change how you relate to yourself and that in turn changes how things effect you.

      I am glad the weekend went ok, but perhaps it would of been more enjoyable for you to have a little time out to spend with your family and without the worry of whether he would show to take you? I am not sure I would want to spend a weekend with someone who told me I made them feel like scum and if you really did make him feel that way I am not sure why he would want to spend it with you either, sound like manipulation on his part to me, we are each responsible for our own feelings after all.

      I like your plan of going with whats right for you and if that is being closer to work and family then go for it. Only by doing what is right for you will things ever change and change is what is needed here. If he is unable or unwilling to change his attitude towards his gambling then it is up to you to take that step forward, it may leave him behind or it may give him the space to look at his own issues without the emotional buffer of you being always available to him but your priority should always be you.

      You talk a lot about what he is going through but don’t you owe it to yourself to reduce the worry and anxiety in your own life by allowing yourself the right environment to grow?

      I think you are being very brave and trying hard to look at the situation objectively. It is not hard to have your happiness dictated to by someone else’s unaddressed addiction, its impossible, so one way or another you have to find a way to unravel yourself from it emotionally and thing will become easier for you. This could mean taking a step back and protecting yourself more or leaving the situation completely, that is something only you can decided.

      Please remember there are no rights or wrongs only what best takes care of you. Lily x

    • #5303

      Hi Lily,

      It was a bit stressful but I have to remember that I can control how stressed I get so I focussed on work instead and left my life not being dictated by gambling.

      I was so thankful for the support and preparation from you and velvet, i’d did help me to think more rationally even when I started to let my thoughts getting out of control.

      My codependency, although enhanced by dating a CG, was prevalent in previous relationships outside of addiction,now that I have gone back and looked into it all. And I looked back at my post when I first came to GT and just looking for help for CG without any realisation that it was also ME that needed help. If nothing else, I will be forever grateful for that. I also now 100% acknowledge that I cant help CG, no matter how much i would love to fix it all. I can work on my issues and my myself better.

      Perhaps you are right.The weekend would definitely have been different. More enjoyable, i’m not sure. And I have to acknowledge that CG really did make an effort. Moving seeing his little boy I know is always hard on him and increases his stress and he did a 6 hour round trip for me. No, it wasnt perfect. But was he trying? Totally.

      Yes the move isnt something taken lightly and it is the best thing for me. Where I am now, I am stalling. CG is stalling on more commitment and i dont want to stay stagnant. There are many many options and I dont know what will happen and its not something im trying to predict or control.

      I just keep trying to work on me and hope that CG wants to work on me. Stresses of my holiday and 2 weeks away are keeping in, especially as its overlaps with CG’s next focus…Aintree!!

      Hope things are well with you and your family. Logic x

    • #5304

      Hi Logic,
      It took me so long to understand what it really meant to care for me and put myself first, the last 8 years to be exact! I started in my time here but it took the other 7 for it all to sink in and for me to really care for myself enough to really know what that meant and tbh I am still working on fully being able to let go of taking responsibility for others behaviors and emotions.

      At the end of your post you say;

      ‘stresses of my holiday and 2 weeks away are keeping in *(did you mean kicking in?), especially as it overlaps with CGs next focus…Aintree.’

      Can I ask you if reading that back sounds like you are caring for yourself? How about ‘I am really looking to my holiday and having a break with my friends, time to relax and think about the best way to move forward with my life, thing have been so hard lately and I need/deserve a break.’ Do you see what I mean. Your focus is not on the best move for you, what you want or need from a relationship, your work or enjoying the holiday you have worked for, they are on the next racing fixture and how that will affect your CG.

      Do you think you worrying about the next big fixture will change whether your partner gambles or not? Do you think it will make any difference whether you are there watching it and his gambling unfold as you did for Cheltenham make any difference to the outcome?

      I can tell you with almost 100% certainty it will not, the only thing that will change any of that is him and why would he? He lives in a house of gamblers, he has money available to gamble, he has a consoling arm around him and a supportive relationship to return to when he is burnt out and even someone to buy him a drink and care about his child.

      It takes two to be codependent so it is not your codependency it is a codependent relationship, but it only takes one person to change the script.

      I hope you understand what I am trying to say and that it doesn’t sound to harsh, it isn’t meant to be, it comes from a place of genuine care and concern for someone I see a lot of younger myself in. Lily x

    • #5305

      Hi Lily,

      Sorry it has taken me so long to reply. Busy couple of days. Your message really resonated with me to I wanted to be able to give it the time to reply properly.

      Oh its so hard to look after myself but I am really taking a step back from the situation and trying to look in objectively.

      Haha yes, i think my brain went for some kind of kicking in/creeping in combo but essentially, yes. I know I can’t stop the gambling, but being so far away raises my anxiety. I will enjoy my holiday I know I will. And that is 100% for me and I am going to be present and its going to make me so happy. I just want to be able to protect myself better against worrying about what is happening back home because I know I will. I cant keep my mind off it constantly for 2 weeks. Especially being on the other side of the world.

      This week is everything I thought it would be. I cant remember what I said about it last week, but I think that CG worked his way up to about a grand and then lost a grand in the space of 1 day betting on Cheltenham.

      However, if you asked CG, he got up to £2.5k, blew a grand and withdrew the rest from his online account. I never for 1 second believed that to be true but for the last 5 days I have been fed promises of this imaginary £1500 and how he is planning on spending it. Its painful to listen to, knowing it is a lie.

      Yesterday he planned to see me but he bailed. He had been drinking the day before and as a result of a hangover and probably having to accept that no imaginary money would be in his account, he bailed and rearranged for today (the day after he has been paid).

      There are a lot of things he is doing at the minute which my logical brain cannot comprehend or understand. But its getting harder and harder. And you are right Lily, there is no reason to change. His mum does everything for him at home and keeps him accountable for his actions whilst allowing him to do exactly what he wants, he has a v well paying job that is almost impossible to lose, other family members will indulge in his addiction, his ex is a reliable and punctual delivery/collection service for his child and I guess I fill the gaps of fulfillment for anything else that he needs. As much as I refuse to bail him out or give him money to feed then addiction, I must be an enabler in some way to allow myself to be continually lied to with no consequences. Justifying his gambling and his need to hide what he is doing and lie and keep doing it. Taking the crap over and over.

      I look at his brother’s gf and ask myself what she is doing with him. People ask that about me and I choose not to listen x

    • #5306

      Work have «messed up» his wages, which really means he lost a lot more last night after he was paid…great.

    • #5307

      Hi Logic,
      Its hard to hear you berating yourself, being in a relationship with a CG particularly one in denial is next to impossible because you don’t ever truly relate, your relationship and his is with the addiction not each other.

      I came to this forum to find out how to help my CG, I was desperate, he had put his life in danger and was receiving death threats, I HAD to help him. Imagine my annoyance when I didn’t get the response I wanted!! I was expecting to either be told to get out while I could or a magic formula for getting him ‘cured’, instead I got told to take care of myself. Frankly I was furious, what were these people going on about? I shouted at my computer, I wrote more posts about yeah, yeah I’m doing that but what about HIM but to no avail it all came back to me taking care of myself, luckily for me Velvet and other contributors were very patient. When i started listening and decided on an ultimatum they warned me not to make it if I couldn’t carry it through. When the ultimatum ultimately failed (as no doubt everyone else expected) I knew to carry it through, I stuck to my word. I felt I had lost my soulmate and my best friend it was only later I realised that I had already lost him to gambling.

      By the time I finally ended it we had lost respect for each other, i worried constantly and felt resentful, his mind twisted by the gambling was resentful of me not believing in his recovery. Had we stayed together I am fairly sure we would of continued an unhealthy relationship and both ended up stuck in a cycle of him gambling, tearful apologies, attempts at recovery and so on spiraling down until we had nothing and I was as far in trouble as he was and all love was gone.

      Instead I went away and worked on myself, kept busy, poured time into my son, improved the relationships I had with friends and family, started a business doing what I loved. I never expected to see him again but I understood what had happened was for the best for us both. From time to time there were emails telling me he he had completed treatment, he had a job, he was working on it although there had been many slips. My partners gambling is deep rooted, the money he has lost is more than many people have seen in a lifetime, gambling addiction is progressive so the longer it goes on the worse it gets so treatment and recovery has been a long road and it is still early days yet.

      7 years on he was come a long way, I have come a long way, despite feeling we would never be back together and accepting that or maybe because we did, here we are in a healthy two way relationship, taking each day as it comes and being open and honest. We are very much together but we also have our separate lives, homes and finances which removes the anxiety and has reinstated the respect.

      My point is while you are not putting yourself first nothing can change for the better. Once a family member or partner has learnt to self care though things can move forward for them and some times this also turns out to be the best thing for the CG too. I am not saying that things work out how you wish now or even as you expect but things have a way of falling into place for YOU and your life will be very different.

      You are right to suspect things are not as he is telling you, they well be worse than you suspect they are, this is my experience. You are doing the right thing protecting yourself financially and by not moving in with him and you have been very courageous working on yourself by doing the counseling, protecting yourself emotionally however is more difficult and some times takes some hard choices as I think you are realising.

      Your holiday should give you a good opportunity to think things over and work out what is best for you.

      Take care, Lily x

    • #5308

      Btw I will be in the F&F group tonight if you want to talk some more. 8pm until 9pm. Lily x

    • #5309

      Hi Lily,

      I will respond properly when I get a chance, hopefully later today. I couldnt get onto the group last night (thursday is a terrible day for me). I hope it went well 🙂

      I spoke to CG last night and told him that I was worried about his gambling. I framed it in a «with what’s happening with the rest of your family, I’m just worried about you». I offered support and my concerns that he was dealing with too much on his own. I had it all rehearsed in my head and couldnt get the words out. So I couldnt really get across what I wanted to say. Not helped by the fact that he wont even enter into a conversation about it. The response was that he was fine and I needed to stop talking about it.

      I feel like I let us both down. I blew my chance.

      Interestingly, he left a scrunched up mini statement in my car (after showing it to me) of his account. He said he was «confused» because his wages hadnt gone in, so the balance should either be £1500 or nothing.

      This is a lie. Its his wages that he blew half of in one evening. Was I suppose to call him out on it? Was that him asking for help? Should I have done more? He asked me to take his bank card so he didnt do something «dangerous» with it today. Was I supposed to take it off him? or let him offer it up?

      These are all rhetorical questions and not really anything you can answer but my mind has been swamped with these thoughts since I didnt manage to get through to him last night.

      Logic x

    • #5310

      Hi Logic,
      Please stop blaming yourself, there is way to convince a gambler in denial to seek help, even a gambler not in denial takes a lot to actually get help often, the addiction fights the idea to the end. You have gone NOTHING wrong.

      If he asks you to take his card though my advice would be to take it there and then, that is a cry for help and needs to be responded to. This gives a glimmer of hope that he is aware of his problem on some level.

      For now be content that you have done all you can and your words may filter through at some point, when HE is ready, that could be tomorrow, next week, next year, in 10 years or sadly never but that is up to him now.

      My advice would be stop chasing him. You could send him a text saying your are happy to have his card if he still wants you to have it. Other than that keep it simple if you do contact him, a simple I love you or can’t reach you but thinking of you etc. It’s his money he is losing, its his problem he is creating he has to realise that himself and you need to give him the space to do that however hard that is.

      Same old same old, look after you, do things you enjoy, try not to worry about it as it won’t make any difference and do not bail him out no matter what the reason he gives for needing money.

      Be strong for you, don’t give yourself away to the addiction as he has. My thoughts are with you. Lily x

    • #5311

      Thanks for the pep talk Lily! Hope you had a nice weekend/mother’s day?

      THE CARD: so after not remembering to take the card away from CG, then texting CG to remind him that he hadnt given his card to me, we had to play the «imaginary lost bank card» game. Except I didn’t play. He tried to claim that he had left the bank card at my house and that I was responsible for him not having the card as I didnt have it. I stated clearly and patiently that it wasnt true that he left it at mine. I sat and read my book whilst he pretended to look for it in my drawers «where he had left it» and again just gave the reasons why he wouldnt be able to find it at my house. The main one being that he was carrying out of my house the day before…

      And I left it there. No enabling. No helping. No engaging in the charade.

      Strangely, on the drive back, out of the blue without any prompt, CG decided to confess he had lied to me. About debt he had racked up on one of his bank cards, which is meant to be impossible to do, and the trouble he was having paying it off and that every payday he would put £50 on a horse to pay it off and every payday he would lose and be down £50, and all of those £50s could have been used to pay the bank back so now that he is what he is doing. Every week £100 to the bank. But then he was talking about blowing through his wages and that he was annoyed giving so much to the bank but he was spending the same easily in one night at the pub drinking/gambling. And that the problem isnt him losing money to the bank, its losing money down the pub.
      Gambling makes him miserable 99 times out of 100.

      These are words i NEVER thought I would hear from CG’s mouth any time soon. And I was so unprepared for it.

      The cynical side of me wonders if that’s just what he thinks I want to hear? Is it manipulation, did he know he had no win with the bank card? But on the other side, it is a place that I never thought I would get to with him? Has something filtered through?

      Anyway, its less than a week until my holiday and that’s alllllll i can think about now! Everything else will take care of itself…
      logic x

    • #5312

      Hi Logic, I have been busy with my partner and my sister the last couple of days but didn’t want you to think I was ignoring you. I will write a full reply as soon as I can. In the meantime I know I have read your post and I am thinking of you. Lily x

    • #5313

      Hi Logic,
      Sorry for the delay in getting back to you properly. My week has been busy Logic, thanks for asking. I have been out riding with my sister and had a visit from my partner. My son has autism and I home educate plus I have been trying to pick up with my business again recently, so never a dull moment!

      It is good to hear that there has been some sort of movement from your CG any kind of admittance of the problem has to be a step in the right direction doesn’t it. It sounds as if you handled the situation well and your different approach caused a different reaction, don’t be surprised if goes back into his shell again though,

      I am glad you have your holiday to look forward to, what ever happens try not to let worry or events spoil that, stay focused on you and your needs. Time away can give you time and space to process things clearly and you may come back with a fresh perspective.

      Like me you live separately from your partner and that affords a good safety net for you to protect yourself from any financial impact, however hard it is to see him struggle it is all down to him now. You have been very honest with him about his gambling and allowed him space to open up, now it really is up to him to seek help from here. By staying strong in yourself, taking time out when you need it, addressing your own needs and working on yourself as you have been the road through for you will become clearer and things will begin dropping into place.

      Be kind to you, one day at a time, Lily x

    • #5314

      Hey Lily,
      Sounds loke youve had an awesome few days. You sound super busy though, dint know how you’re fitting it all in.

      You were right about his shell. In fact, he managed to take a step back. Sent me messages yesterday asking for money for some made up excuse. He knows not to ask me for money. After the conversation we had at the weekemd, i know that its money that he can’t afford to lose. So i hope he hasn’t managed to find it elsewhere.
      Obviously i told him that i wouldn’t give him any money and he hasnt spoken to me since.

      WOrk is stressful as I’m about to take 2 weeks off and my anxiety is really up. I’m trying to look after myself, but this week is a trying week! Sunday can’t come quickly enough. I’m desperate for a break and proper sleep.

      I hope it all starts to settle soon but I’m about to disrupt the norm so we will see.

      Thanks Lily!!

    • #5315

      Hi again Logic, it is amazing what you can fit in when you change your focus and take care of you, worry and anxiety take up so much time and energy I discovered!

      Well done for not enabling by giving money. Time for you now to wrap up your busy week at work, pack your bag and enjoy your holiday. Try to be in the moment, thinking about your holiday and not worrying about what he’s up to, worrying never changed anything did it after all?

      Take care of YOU and keep on keeping on, Lily x

    • #5316

      Hi Logic, I was thinking you must be back from your holiday and was wondering how you were doing? Hopefully you had a relaxing time and fun with the girls.
      Lily x

    • #5317

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks for checking in on me. I had a wonderful holiday, thank you. It was great to have a break and all of the trust and the worry that I was scared would taint my holiday, didnt effect me at all. Which is something that really surprised me.

      My codependent nature decided to rear its ugly head after a few drinks one night which I was really disappointed with myself about. So I’m adjusting my behaviour to keep myself in check and realise just how easy it is to slip.

      The time away seems to have been good for CG too but it is early days yet. Again he has talked about how much he hates gambling and wasting all his wages on gambling. He has self excluded online again (or so he says) but is still saying that he «only» wants to put on his little £5 bets at the bookies. So not quite there but taking steps towards acknowledging the problem.

      He is plowing his wages into buying things now, for his mum, for his little boy, for me and has already managed a date night and has another one planned for tonight. So its nice to see him using his money more positively, rather than just handing it straight to the bookies on pay day.

      I’ve just read your post, very jealous of all of the easter treats 😉 but I’ve just had 2 weeks in America so who am I to talk. Glad its going well for you.

      Logic x

    • #5318

      Hi Logic, so glad you had a good holiday and managed to (mostly) but your concerns about your cg to one side, baby steps in the right direction for you both by the sound of it.

      I am sure that I don’t have to tell you that having ‘little bets’ isn’t possible for a CG and it will always come back and bit them on the bum! However I am glad he is enjoying things outside of gambling more and able to treat you (hopefully not from his ‘winnings’). Realising all the positive in their lives and rekindling and deepening personal relationships can really help with moving forward so fingers crossed. I have to ask though if he hates gambling and wants to give it up then why is he entertaining it still?

      I hope you will be able to stay in the ‘zone’ after your holiday and worry a little less and enjoy your life a little more. Have a good date night and keep taking care of YOU. It was a long hard road for me and my CG but it was only by making the right (though often hard) choices for me that the relationship is where it is now which tbh is far more than I ever would of expected back then. Lily x

    • #5319

      Hi Lily,

      I think the break was good for the both of us, it gave me some respite from gambling and it gave him space to think.

      Oh I completely agree with you! But any recognition that gambling was detrimental to progress was completely absent from CG even a few weeks ago. So him now recognising that changes are to be made to improve his standard of living is an amazing start in my book. I was worried I would never even see that day!

      In answer to your question, gambling is his security blanket. His self confidence is terrible and he will work as hard as he can sometimes to push me away, i think out of fear of rejection or that I will see him for who he truly is and wont like it. So he cant let the mask slip too much. Plus, i’m sure in his head, that if he tells me he is going cold turkey and «fails» like last time, I wont look at him the same way, so its an easy way to pacify me and protect himself because he cant fail if he hasnt quit.

      Im working on encouraging him to trust me to let me in to offer support and, hopefully, if he can start to recognise that not gambling can make him happier than gambling, then the little bets can be knocked on the head. Its such a big ask for CG at this stage though. And as I’ve learned, it has to come from him, me adding pressure (or being «judgemental» as he likes to call it) wont help the situation. So i’m taking a massive step back and letting him figure it out on his own.

      I’m still making the right choices for me. I had an interview for a new job, which is killing CG as it would mean I would be further away. But its what I need to be doing and I’m building up to find a way to discuss with him all of the support I have been receiving to show him that its okay to ask for help.

      My mindset has completely changed in respect of all of this and im hoping that some of that will rub off on CG. I just have to keep making good choices and working hard on myself, the rest is out of my control. Logic x

    • #5320

      It is great to hear you doing the things that you need to do in your life. As you say moving forward yourself is a great example but also strengths you and will help you cope with whatever life throws at you. It really seems as if your holiday has done you the power of good. Good Luck with the interview, let us know how it goes. Lily x

    • #5321

      Hi Velvet,

      Hopefully you will see this as i have seen your post to Lily. I saw on your post to one of the other threads you talking about «listening ears». I was just wondering if you had any tips about how to be a better listener as F&F of a CG. My CG is starting to open up a bit more about talking about gambling, which is great and i want to encourage that. But i catch myself asking questions which he could take to be quite judgy or saying nothing at all and, therefore, offering no support. I want to keep communication open but i feel like i am the one shutting it down when it starts. any tips would be appreciated!

      Oh and Lily, I have been offered a second interview next month so we will see how that goes 🙂

    • #5322

      Hiya Logic
      I realise now that when my CG was active I probably gave up listening for years before he sought recovery – I was always looking for the words to save him — so in retrospect I probably kept talking ‘at’ him.
      He told me that when I came into the room, or he came home, he would make an excuse as to why he couldn’t talk at that time — he wanted to change or settle down for a minute which seemed understandable. However what he really wanted was time to get his addiction into gear and ready for anything I was going to say. Looking back he was right — I was always questioning — asking for a return of money or what had happened to such and such, or why hadn’t he answered his mobile, etc. etc.. For my part I would dread opening my mouth because I knew I was going to be bamboozled and I stood outside many doors counting to at least 10.
      When he changed his life, the questions (and the past) were still unanswered but I was confronted with such a difference in my CG that I was frozen into silence in case I mucked up anything that might suggest a true recovery. However, I am above all things a female, so in the end I talked. I asked him to help me, to help me get it right. He told me not to worry because if I messed up he now had people to turn to who could support him the right way. I was disappointed and I told him that I really wanted to get things right but that I needed help to do so – I didn’t want him walking away and feeling he had to get support because of something I had said or done wrong. So he told me little bits to start with and I listened and this worked for us.
      Your CG has been living a difficult double life for so long – most CGs don’t actually know when they started, so to unravel such a long experience takes time, even years. Pennies are still dropping years later which is why a true recovery is such an on-going joy. CGs are impatient but recovery requires patience. I believe that F&F are impatient too – we want the polished article but we have to wait and the wait can be frustrating.
      I asked my CG why it took so long and he told me that in the rehab a seed had been planted and they had watered it and tended it until it had grown into a visible shoot ready to be re-planted in the world. A shoot takes time to grow and longer to bud and a bud takes time to flourish — every day it requires maintenance until a long time later (maybe months or years) it blossoms.
      You are part of the maintenance Logic – ask him to tell you when to water, when to feed and when to hold back. You may well make mistakes; I made a massive one but was able to explain that I still hadn’t completely understood and by then he knew that I was trying.
      The judgy questions are the same as weeds; they choke the growth, so chuck ‘em on the compost heap. Keep doing what you are doing because you are doing well – listen and when in doubt say nothing. If your CG is in a true recovery you will have your answers in time – but let the blossom come first.
      Your CG wants to live a gamble-free life. Living a ‘normal’ life does not require praise so, in my opinion, be interested but not effusive. Encourage by saying ‘I didn’t know that’ when he tells you how he feels without demanding more than he is prepared to give at any one time. Maybe come here, or to a group, to talk about what he has said and any questions you might have, rather than questioning him.
      If I haven’t helped then come back to me – a different way of saying something is often necessary – and I have my listening ears firmly in place.
      I hope you do well with your second interview

    • #5323

      Hi Logic, well done on the second interview, great news! Velvet has written you such a great reply and I love her analogy about the seed. I still think your CG is looking for the right place for that seed to land however and being blown about in the wind right now. It really does take seeking helping from outside to dig down and really start to move forward.

      I made so many mistakes dealing with those early says although from time to time my CG will come back to me and say you know that really helped when you said blah blah. He said the other day that I was the first person who had a proper conversation about his gambling and really listened and that that all those years ago had stayed with him. I don’t actually remember the conversation myself but I think it was in a period when we were ‘just’ friends and so it would of been non judgmental and without a vested interest or desire to fix him so that is probably what made the difference. I think really listening and trying to understand their perspective even if it makes no sense to us non-cg’s is the key.

      Lily x

    • #5324

      hey Logic, how are things? Any news on the new job? Thinking of you, Lily x

    • #5325

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks for thinking of me. Things aren’t good with CG at all at the minute. I can’t really see the light there anymore and its been a really tough week.

      My interview is next friday so i will let you know. Trying to do my own thing but its not always easy to keep a clear head.

      Logic x

    • #5326

      Hi Logic,
      I am sorry things have been tough. In what way? You know no matter how bad things are you can always post here, even if it is just a rant to let off steam, there is always someone to listen. I know in the early days sometimes I didn’t post when things were bad as I felt I was in someway betraying my partner but honestly everyone here knows how hard it can be and understand that when the addiction is controlling the person they are not the real them, it is important for you to have somewhere you can be totally honest without judgement and on the forum that is always true.

      I am glad you are still pursuing your own career and dreams that is so important and can only ever be the right thing to do.

      Look forward to hearing how the interview went, Lily x

    • #5327

      Hi Lily,

      I dont even know where to start with all of last week. It was a series of stupid petty arguments, which could have been solved straight away but escalated and grew and became something utterly ridiculous that I had to just walk away from it all. There was no rationalising, understanding or anything. He had seen red and was destructive and mean and it was just so tiring and draining on me.

      I think things are better now and I talked about the help I’ve been getting and how good it has been to me. CG acknowledged that he could probably use some help too, but when i asked him where he wanted to start with it, he said he didnt and he would do it on his own.

      I know that it isnt CG. I know his actions are a product of his addiction and his resulting self confidence but its so draining on me. I’m tired.

      My friends will be mad that i havent walked away from him…again.

      For me: I am going home at the weekend for my interview and i will see my family and my friends. Just feels like a long hard slog to Friday.

      Thanks for the continued support, Lily. I wasnt being purposefully absent. I just think i understand more about what you mean when you say that there is no room inside a CG’s head for anyone else. I dont think i could have been there for anyone last week. My head was stuck in my relationship.

      Logic x

    • #5328

      Hi Logic, it is great to see you posting but please, please do it for you. This is the place you should be able to come to be honest about how you feel and get support for yourself. Yes we can advise on patterns, likely behavior and treatment for a partner or family member who is a compulsive gambler (CG) but primarily it is to help you through your journey.

      I am not sure what you mean by I know it is CG? is it a typo? Did you mean I know it isn’t me? This addiction has a way of not only filling up the one suffering from it but the ones who come into contact with that person to. This is why we always say take care of you first and foremost.

      It seems he is moving slowly forward, he wants to get help and he is right that is something he has to do for himself. A hey well done or I’m proud of you for seeing/doing that will go a long way, don’t get to involved listen rather than question when you can.

      I am pleased you are going on with this interview and seeing your family at the weekend, thesse are good healthy signs for you. Don’t let the addiction fill you up make space for the joy and pleasure in life and that will keep you strong and ultimately be the best thing for you both.

      Lily x

    • #5329

      Hi Lily,

      My last post was slightly rushed, so apologies for the garbled mess.
      I knew I should have posted and I was a bit annoyed with myself for not as I know it would help me. I was just consumed with what was going on.

      This week is much better. I’m putting healthy distance back between me and the gambling. I have more time and a better mindset for my friends. I just feel better.

      When i said «I know it isnt CG» I meant that I knew that the anger wasnt him, it was totally his addiction and I could see that so clearly on his face when I finally saw him on Sunday.

      He wants to withdraw all of the money he has been saving through work to buy a car. This is again something I’ve heard many times before, he has enough saved for a car. He has asked me to be there on Wednesday when he gets paid to make sure I take the money away from him. I’m not even sure he has actually asked for it back yet so I dont know how to play it at all. The last thing I want is more arguments.

      I agree he is moving slowly but i’m just not sure he will ever get to a point that he will actually want to deal with it head on. I think he would like to tackle it but its just way too big of a trauma for him to do. I’d love him to because underneath all of the other issues, he is the most incredible guy. He is just consumed by it all.

      Yeah the weekend with my family will be nice.I dont get to see them anywhere near as much as i should. Guess that will change if the job interview goes well.

      Logic x

    • #5330

      Hi Logic,

      It was lovely to see you offering support on Carmen’s thread and I am glad you are feeling a little better. With this addiction there are often some hard choices and decisions to be made but I think once we start seeing that we do have a choice it is a sign of our own recovery and can actually be empowering. The CG does not have a choice, they have to live with their addiction for the rest of their lives whether in denial, treatment or recovery, they can however make a choice to get help, but however hard it is for us to live along side this addiction, it is hard for them to see the addiction for what it is.

      In your post you mention both you and your partner being consumed and that is what the addiction can do. It is like an encroaching poisonous fog that first envelops the CG and then those around them, all are suffering but can’t see a way out, there are signs however that you are now able to see over it and I think there are glimmers your partner is too. I think you are wise though to be cautious particularly with his family history and the situation he is in.

      His recent behavior is probably down to panic, panic he is losing you to this job. A CG will like to keep the equilibrium, if you change and move forward he might have to too, sometimes when a CG is unable to keep up the charming facade it is because the addiction feels it is being challenged and starts thrashing about. The best thing you can do is keep calm and carry on, carry on with your recovery, your life, your plans, with looking after you.

      Sometimes partners believe it is about leaving the person behind, it is not, it is about stepping back into you, that means you are strong, you are present and you are authentic, not swayed from your path by pressures around you. People talk about someone being their ‘rock’ and this is often seen as the person who is always there picking up the pieces however I think a true rock is the person who is centered in themselves that they can be a calm, unwavering force, a constant in a stormy sea. I heard an analogy the other day about being a light house,( it was related to having an autistic child who is very demand avoidant, but I think it relates well to CG’s too). ‘You need to be like a light house, there shining out so you are seen and recognised as a safe place but remembering you are not a life boat rushing in to save.’

      Will you be there to take care of his car money? I think it is a good sign he has asked you myself, it may show he is recognising his own inability to handle money but just be careful it is not an elaborate rouse to make you feel that he is being sensible. Would he be willing for you to go car hunting with him so you can see the money handed over? I was shocked the other day when my CG told me he sometimes put in place the idea for a manipulation to get money or cover his tracks months in advance back when he was gambling, I didn’t realise it could be that thought through. You learn something new everyday.

      Be kind to yourself Logic, you are doing better than you think and don’t give up hope anyone can change if they want to, some just take longer than others, Lily x

    • #5331

      Hi Lily,

      I think i was mostly annoyed that I let myself fall back into the trap. I know the signs I know what to look out for and I know what he is doing. And i let the gambling effects affect me again.

      Boy your post came at the right time. CG was all excited to make plans for the weekend so i had to tell him i was at home for the weekend and for my interview. He brooded on it all night and basically gave me an ultimatum — him or the job. I pointed out that I was going for an interview and nothing has been set in stone yet. But without him there is no reason for me to be where I am at the minute and he doesnt want and cant work towards a future with me.

      So today has been very much toys out of the pram. And you are right, its because I’ve upset the balance.

      I love that lighthouse analogy! its so true. I spent such a long time either being the one who wanted to save him or not understanding why i wasnt enough to make him want to stop.Obviously, i know better now.

      My CG always responds best to me being strong and thats what i need to keep doing. Maybe he will want to be better, maybe he will see me as moving away as being a step too far and go backwards.

      The car. He has told me he wants my help with it all as I’m much more organised and I’m good with this kind of stuff. He wants me to have the money, but already the excuse is that his manager hasnt released the money so he wont get paid it today.

      He was cooking last night and told his mum he had spent £150 in the pub last week. she asked why i wasnt doing more to take the money off him to stop him going to the pub. which is a bit unfair. i refuse to be the fun police to my CG. I’m not financially reliant on him. I dont need his money so if he wants that reigning in, that needs to come from him. I have no intention of telling him what to spend his money on.

      I am being kind to me, Lily and Friday is giving me a focus.

      Logic x

    • #5332

      Hi Logic, I am on a break from cleaning out my sheds/home educating my son in the garden so this is only a very quick one. Have you read the post ‘the gambling cycle’? I know you read a lot on here so you probably have but I will bring it back up to the top just in case..

      Two more quick things — don’t be thrown off what is best for you by your partner, don’t let him or his addiction hold you back. I can tell you categorically the best thing you can do for him is by doing what is best for you in terms of life choices. I have my fingers crossed for you for Friday.

      And £150…at the pub? Really…

      Your doing great, stay strong and look after yourself, Lily x

    • #5333

      Thanks, Lily. I’ll be sure to look over it.
      Sounds like a nice chilled day for you!

      Well that’s what he told me. £150. Reckons he was buying rounds. Said his brother did £300 just on horses the same day.

      Yeah I’m trying. This weekend will definitely get my head straight.

    • #5334

      Hi I have only just been able to bring up the post it is called the f&f cycle and is by velvet. It will be the post below this now x

    • #5335

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks for bringing up the cycle. I have seen it before but it is good to be reminded. Should have looked at that last week.

      Its strange. When I am by myself I am very clear about what i need to do in my best interests and there is no doubt in my mind about what I need to be doing. But as soon as i’m with CG i doubt everything I am doing.

      I know we both love each other and i know that whilst we are on the path we are currently on I can never have the things I want for me to be happy in life. I dont want to compromise my future happiness for instant happiness right now. but i know it’s going to be super tough to have that strength to walk away from someone I care about so deeply.

      CG is ill. Good news: keeps him out of the pub. Bad news: he is low, tired, grumpy and bored with a nice wad of cash sitting in his bank account waiting to spend.

      He looked at a race at Chester on Wednesday and commented that one of the horses was «an old favourite» that he liked to back. Soon he realised there were 2/3 of his favourites in that race. and by the time he had looked at the whole list he realised at one point or another he had backed considerable amounts on all of the runners.

      we had another chat about how miserable gambling makes him. but there is no willing to change. its just lip service because he knows that its what I want to hear.

      Anyway, today and tomorrow are about doing things for me. Just need to get through this morning and survive the long drive then its me me me!

      Hope you’ve got a good weekend planned x

    • #5336

      I am glad the F&F Cycle post was of use, we all need reminders sometimes, posting here is mine and I find more and more I read on the my journal too. Reading there it reminds me how far my partner has come. It is funny all these people with unique personalities all with the same excuses for why they are still gambling, all speaking with one voice — that of the addiction. There is always that one favorite they don’t want to miss, the sure thing, the tip or the sign that their luck has changed or the reason they were driven to it and just found themselves in the bookies again followed by the awful realization that they have been hoodwinked by their addiction and lost everything yet again…

      Things do filter through though, drip by drip if a CG is moving towards acceptance of their addiction. I don’t believe words are wasted and I think less is more with time in between for those words to filter through.

      So…Big day today! I really hope the interview goes well. As I said in my earlier post doing what you need to do for you is about stepping back into your true self not about moving away from him, I think ultimately it can take the pressure off the CG to know that another person has not been messed up by his addiction, they tend to carry a lot of guilt and regret around which erodes self confidence and self worth and makes recovery even harder. Doing what is right for you to build a good, positive life and make you stronger and happier can only ever be the right thing to do.

      My partner is coming down on Sunday and really looking forward to seeing him, its been two weeks since his last visit.
      I hope you have a lovely weekend with your family and time out to focus on you, there is nothing wrong with a bit of me, me, me sometimes! Enjoy your me time and all the best with your interview, Lily x

    • #5337

      Hi Logic
      I hope your ‘me’ time is as good as it should be – with no thoughts of gambling hanging over you.
      Your last post concerns me on a few levels, the main one being that when you are with your CG you doubt everything you are doing. It is important Logic that you make the decisions about your life, that you are in control of your life and that an addiction is not allowed to pull your strings in any shape or form.
      His reading about the race at Chester seems to point to the fact there is no let up in his addiction, he is indulging it. Even when he is too ill to go and place his bets he is keeping his addiction alive in his mind. I don’t believe that what you want to hear is lip service and if this is what you are hearing then maybe it is time to stop listening to his addiction and listen to the one person who should have your interests at heart — you.
      I think it would be good if you were to re-read your last post and imagine someone you care about saying to you that they are currently on a path where they will never have the things to make them happy in life.
      If he was showing a glimmering of truly wanting to change then I would view your posts in a different light but it seems to me he is choosing to carry on gambling because that is what he really thinks makes him happy and that is not a good basis for a loving relationship.
      Keep posting Logic and stay clear about what is right for you when you are with or without your CG.

    • #5338

      Hi Lily, hi velvet,

      Firstly, the interview. I think things went really well. They really liked me and I think they will want to offer me something. I am a bit of a niche character in my field though, so think there may be logistics issues and if they can offer me the right role/salary. They dont seem to be in a big rush to make me an offer either, which is a bit annoying and leaves me a little in limbo.

      Secondly, the rest of my weekend. It was awesome to see my parents and I went for lunch with them and it was brill. And i saw my best friends which was also great. They both know what is going on with CG and what’s been going on with me and have been a lot more supportive. Although one of them is very very vocal about disliking CG rather than supporting me.

      So she had a go at me about CG, which came from a good place but was just an attack on CG rather than support for me. She obviously has he own views about addiction, I made it clear that I didnt want to talk about addiction but she pushed the point saying that I was bottling things up. So that escalated as she wasnt willing to listen and was coming out with things like «If CG CHOSE not to gamble anymore, Logic, he wouldnt be an addict.» So that was really frustrating and in the end i just had to stop talking and walk away from the situation.

      Just feel like a voice drowning among the more shouty voices at the min. And that isnt me. I’m usually very headstong on my views and opinions but i’m just tired of being backed into corners and trying to fight my way out.

      CG and I have had a difficult few weeks. As discussed above, with the chance that I may be moving away and i know there have been a lot of things that have happened recently where CG is pushing for a reaction from me. Unfortunately, he knows the right buttons to press with me, so sometimes I do react in a more volatile and confrontational way than I should.

      Oh i completely agree that he is indulging it. His dad had had a couple of wins so his interest was peaked and he had a weekend by himself, ill and bored. Everyday his parents order the papers, everyday he comes home from work, first thing he does is grab the paper and straight to the racing section. Its habit. I’m under no illusion that there is nothing in him that actually wants to stop gambling, no matter how much he says he hates it.

      I get that my post is concerning, it wasnt meant to be. I was just trying to be honest. When I’m away from him like now, it is so easy and clear in my mind that i need to step away.
      1) in order to break the cycle
      2) for CG to have any chance of actually making a change
      3) and most importantly, for me. To save myself. To do the things that are right for me. To move myself forwards. To be happy.

      But then I’m with CG and i just feel like, it could all just be so easy. It really could. And i know im wandering around in my rose tinted specs where nothing is going to change and I’m happy in the moment but not in the long term. I just cant imagine my life without him in it.

      I dont know how else to describe it. When i’m with CG, its like im in a dream. Its what I want but its not real. and eventually I go back to my real life and i remember that there’s a lot of negatives around all of this and it is really pulling me down. I am letting the addiction pull me strings and i need to be putting more barriers in place to stop it.

      Thanks for listening both. I realised this weekend how much i still need support . Can one of you please confim the time of the F&F group on Thurs. I usually struggle with Thursdays but the 21.00-22.00 time on the group page must be wrong as i was planning on being in the group last week but i think i missed it. x

    • #5339

      I find that comment very interesting, Logic because that is exactly how I felt about gambling. I felt my life without gambling would be a form of death. Indeed, I often looked on people who didn’t gamble as missing out on life.
      This just highlights how flawed our thinking becomes when we succumb to illusions.
      It interests me even more that a non CG (you, in this case) would /could become so sucked into the «Illusion» that yo need it as your escape.
      Both the CG and the victim become puppets on strings in this warped illusion.
      For things to change, the Puppet Master needs to cut the strings.
      Are you ready to take on the role of puppet master?
      I find ready F and F very helpful.

    • #5340

      Hi Vera,

      Thanks so much for posting on my thread. It’s really good to have some perspective from the «other» side(!)

      I have often said, perhaps tongue in cheek, I’m not sure, that CG is my addiction. And indeed, i related my feelings in relation to being co-dependent to being part of this.

      It’s interesting that you using the word «escape» makes me look at this again in a whole new light. CG is totally my escape from the «real world». I can go to that bubble where things arent real and get the release i am looking for.

      I think I’m ready to cut the strings and take back control. That’s why it is a little frustrating that my potential new job opportunity is dragging its heels. I want to have all my ducks in a row and take back control of me and my feeling and my emotions. But maybe the job is my excuse to not pushing on…?

      I also find the «my journal» forum so interesting and helpful to my understanding. You are all so supportive of each other and I admire that. I feel like the last 6 months have been a HUGE learning curve for me and everyday I learn more. Including today!

      So thank you for making me think in a different way…again 🙂

    • #5341

      Hi Logic
      The F&F group is between 20.00-21.00 hours UK time / 8pm – 9pm British Summer Time. The best way to enter a group is to click on the Helpline and scroll down at 20.00 hours or 8pm and click F&F where it says ‘join’. The group can also be found under Support Groups but only the ‘F’ can be seen as another group is running at the same time and it is tricky clicking the ‘F’ – at least I think it is!!
      I am glad that having read Vera’s post you have seen things from another extremely honest and relevant perspective because I have been struggling to see a good outcome for your relationship when I read your recent posts. You seem to accept that your CG has no intention of giving up his addiction but sometimes you seem happy to accept it. Does the indecisiveness come from reading posts like Lilly’s and mine where there was an eventual happy outcome because if so what you are missing is the days, months and years of pain that it took for us to get to where we are now.
      CGs do make it look easy – if they didn’t and they were not charming people nobody would ever enable them. With their addiction they are often the life and soul of the party but take the addiction away and you can be left with a very quiet, introverted thinker. I knew a woman in Gamanon who wanted her husband to go back to his addiction because she found him boring without it!
      You ‘know’ that your boyfriend is a CG but I think you are unaware how far down he and his addiction can pull you. I didn’t enable for 25 years because I was in a dream and I didn’t wear rose-tinted glasses, I hung on through ignorance first, then shame and finally fear and as it turned out I had every reason to fear.
      It took a parting of the ways for my CG to spiral into a black and terrible abyss that eventually resulted in him at last ‘wanting’ to control his addiction. It took me a very, very long time and many Gamanon meetings to begin to get a half decent life together. I finally entered a course of study of the addiction to gamble to try to make sense of my experience. Having added knowledge to my experience I was able to join GT.
      Take more care of yourself Logic, don’t let the new job be an excuse to let a negative situation drag on – this addiction has nothing good about it when it is active.

    • #5342

      It’s very true, to say, Velvet , that a CG appears to be the life and soul of the party when we are on a role.
      When the party finishes though, we find that same life and soul has been sucked out of us and out of God knows how many others as a result of our selfish antics. The gambling legacy takes a heavy toll.
      Recovery for CG and «Victim» can be slow and lifeless for a while.
      At GA meetings, I hear men talking about «A life beyond their wildest dreams» now that they have stopped gambling.
      I’m still searching for that life. I find instead a rather empty life but «empty» beats the «fullofshit’n’grief»life that I existed in when I was chasing the «buzz».
      Gambling is an easy way out but the consequences come with a high price tag for everyone the «disease»attacks.
      Just for today I cannot gamble.

    • #5343

      Hi Velvet, Vera.

      Thanks again for your refreshing posts.

      Thanks for the update about the group. I definitely got the time wrong last week.
      The channel name at the bottom of the support group page says «Friends & Family Peer Support (V) Every week, on Thursday, from 21:00 to 22:00» so this might need updating if possible.

      I’m definitely not happy to know that CG is an addict and just accept it. I guess i just dont know the best thing to do. I want to support him so I’m trying not to be negative about the situation but perhaps I just avoid the situation. I would estimate that probably about 90% of what I have expressed on here I wouldnt be able to say to CG. It took me 3 months to even tell him I had been and got support.

      But I’ve sat and reflected a lot on this today and maybe that is because i’ve just been too weak to really tackle the issue head on. and although I am trying to understand and look after myself and my own wellbeing, I am still being weak and not making the decision I should be making. Honestly, I’m scared of the days, weeks, months, years of pain.

      I dont think I’m ignorant to the addiction. but even I act like an addict towards him. He does something that I would tell my friends isnt acceptable. I tell myself it isnt acceptable. But then i calm down and maybe he will do something to remind me its good or i convince myself it will be better/different/something will change this time surely and I’m back again.

      I feel like moving away and starting my new job is all part of my forward steps and getting myself back on track but ive become impatient. My friend asked me what was stopping me just handing in my notice and starting the process now but I want to do it the right way. Knowing I have secured my new job and where I am going. Going back to my parents jobless isnt what I want and neither is staying here in this tortuous job and annoying home.

      With regards to CG, i see the vunerable, self-conscious side to him quite a lot when he lets himself show that side of him to me. I dont see him as the life and soul of the party at all but he is very very easy to love and to get people to take a shine to him.

      I would think that CG believes that he is only worthy of the shitandgrief life and i dont think he could sit comfortably with empty over stressful.

      I just want to be stronger than I am.

    • #5344

      Hi Logic
      There is nothing weak about saying you are confused about a gambling addiction and you don’t know which way to turn.
      Sometimes even the strongest have to get a kick-start to alter the course of their life but you have the possibility of a new job which will hopefully give you the impetus to make a good move that will be right for you. I can’t see any benefit in giving up your present job until you are sure you have the new one but hopefully you will get it and your way will seem clearer.
      In my opinion, the vulnerable self-conscious side that you see is probably manipulative. With control of the addiction comes brutal honesty and it was then my CG told me that the tears were never for me and were only for himself. He wasn’t the life and soul of the party but he was loved and people did trust and like him – what I was trying to show you was that the active CG is very different to the one who controls his addiction and until that control is taken it is impossible to know what is true and what isn’t because a CG drastically changes reality to fit his/her personal perception.
      I don’t think you are ignorant of the addiction, just the depths to which it can take you and while your job seems tortuous and your home seems annoying I believe you are probably vulnerable to someone that people take a shine to — but I am confident that you will be stronger because you are here and listening.
      Speak again soon

    • #5345

      I am off on holiday tomorrow but it was good to catch up with you in the group and I wanted to leave you a post before I left. I have had my partner here until Wednesday which is why I haven’t had a chance to respond before but I can see you have been well supported.

      As Velvet and Vera have already said there are no quick fixes or easy outcomes, loving a CG is full of difficult choices. I know you have read my posts and know the many years of struggle we have had and don’t forget my partner was already aware and voicing to me the depth of his addiction when I met him yet it was years before he sought help and then only when he got into a situation where he felt his life was in danger and with a lot of pressure from both myself and his Mum, even after getting that help it was years again before he could use the tools he has been given.

      A CG does not just wake up one morning, admit he has a problem, seek help and be cured but I know you know this. It is hard to accept. I used to think if only the gambling was sorted things would be perfect. In truth I am glad it took my CG time to recover and we had space from each other, he needed it, I needed it too for my recovery.

      Without us both turning ourselves inside out and looking at all the deep dark corners we would not have the relationship we have today. I am proud of him for the work he put in and I am also proud of me. We are two strong independent people who chose to be together but would also be fine apart, it is now a healthy relationship.

      It is very true what Velvet said about the change in a person after they enter recovery. In the old days my CG was a villain and a tough guy, the was also charming and charismatic, he had that edge of danger. These days he is a big softy, he jokes about getting old and boring and is a lot less unpredictable. All the things he was in the past excited the old me, it is only that I have grown myself that means I now much prefer the new him. Equally I was far more volatile and unpredictable myself, I was temperamental and emotionally dependent on him. If one of us had changed without the other the reconciliation never would of worked. If he had not changed his recovery would not be continuing. If I had not changed I would still be falling for the same type of man he used to be.

      The best thing you can ever do is work on you for you, we always say about a CG ‘they have to want to’ this equally applies to us, we have to really want to grow and change and move forward, it can be scary, it can mean leaving people behind, it is a leap of faith but I can tell you doing what is best for you is always the right thing to do. Being strong is about looking after you it is not about being a constant receiver of someone else’s problems without complaint or showing distress, it took me a long time to learn this!

      I have to go as I have lots of packing to do but I will be thinking of you and hope to hear great news about your job when you get back. Lily xx

    • #5346

      So i got the job!! There’s a bit more negotiation to be done but we are there and there is a new chapter waiting for me. It suddenly seems all very final. My parents are happy that i’ll be moving back cliser to them and it feels like a weight lifted off after the horrible stress of my current job.

      The next hurdle for me. How to tell CG. I know all of my many reasons for this move including the fact that he isn’t going to change. He won’t want to listen. Any previous mention of my taking the job has just let to «well then lets just break up. There’s nothing left»
      I just don’t know the best way to deal with this. I do really love him. I just don’t love him in his gambing costume.

      He is really active at the minute. I can’t even ***** the number of times he went to the bookies at the weekend. Him feeding his loose change into a fruit machine in the chippy. So hard to be around.

      The sad thing is that his little boy is aware of it now and hates it. I can’t protect him against that and how do i even go about talking to a 6 year old about it??

      But i know he doesnt want to change what he is doing. For me. For his boy. For himself. And there’s nothing else i can do.

      Lily I appreciate your words and I totally get everything you are saying. I hope you are having an awesome holiday and aren’t reading this until you are home.

    • #5347

      I don’t know what those stars are all about??

      I definitely wrote C O U N T!

    • #5348

      Hi Logic
      Terrific, congratulations, you have earned a gold star and a new life beckons.
      You can’t talk to a 6 year old about his father’s addiction but he has a mum that you say sounds great so I am sure she will protect him as he grows older – he cannot be your responsibility however much you feel he should be.
      All your previous attempts to tell your CG about your new job have fallen on stony ground – an active CG will only worry about what is happening today and until you make your move for him nothing has or will change.
      His gambling is more than part of his costume, sadly for the time being it is who he is and you are right you cannot protect him from himself.
      I’m not sure how much he will listen to you now, he doesn’t process thought as you do. You want to make this change because he will not and I don’t see any reason in telling him anything other than the truth. If everybody in the life of a CG gives that person a let out – in other words if you say you are moving for a better job, more money to be near you parents etc., but you don’t tell him the truth, how will he ever learn that his addiction is losing him things that matter. Maybe this shake-up will help your CG make better choices in the future, we can only hope so — but you have made the choice that is right for you and in this forum that is a great outcome.
      I hope you really love your new job Logic and it gives you the life you deserve. You have had an experience that can be used in your life for the good – I don’t believe in allowing bad experiences to embitter us or to go on hurting us when we have made the right changes for ourselves.
      Wishing all the best

    • #5349

      Ohhh CG!! Today is payday. This weekend we are taking his boy to the seaside for his first scout camp. And we are going to spend a day (and night) at the seaside. Did someone say rain?

      This afternoon CG sent money to me to keep hold of for the spends and hotel.

      This evening i get a very flattering and complimentary text, more so than usual. Overkill maybe. And then i read it properly. Asking for his money back. I reply and didn’t acknowlege the money. He messaged again straight away asking for it. So now I’m too busy to reply. I’ve been reassured that its too late for the pub now so he won’t waste it there. I know where you want to waste it. I’m sure by the time i wake up i will have stolen his money and lots of other nasty things. He will thank me tomorrow (hopefully) but not tonight.

      This is why i never wanted his money in my account. I don’t know if keeping it against his will is what i should do. I feel like it is. Its just a weird feeling for me.

    • #5350


      What a lovely post! I actually felt really proud of myself after reading your message.

      I know I can’t talk to him about his dad but its hard when he just disappears from the house and his little boy is looking for him «have you seen my dad…i hope he didn’t go to the bookies». Thats hard.

      I don’t think for a second he will want to listen to why i am going. He knows why really. I think he just thinks I’m happy to carry on this way. In a half assed relationship that only works one way. When i first met him he wanted to btter himself, he wanted to impress me. And he tried so hard. But it could never be sustainable without support and at that time i was uneducated and naive. Its hard to look back at the downfall but some of that is down to me. I made it easy for him to stop trying.

      I hope this does shake him up a bit. He is a great guy. I don’t want for him to lose that and become an empty vessel like his family members. I want good things for him. I just can’t give them to him. He has to fight for them.

    • #5351

      Hey Logic, so happy to come back and read your news. What a remarkable woman you are that in the midst of the gambling chaos you went and got a great new job and made steps to change your life for the better, really well done.

      You will now be near friends and family and have more support for you, as Velvet says the shake up may change things for your CG, one things for sure that nothing was going to change by you staying where you were.

      I hope things go smoothly for you, stay strong, you are doing great, Lily x

    • #5352

      Well done on getting the job despite all the chaos and strife.
      Have you told «himself» yet? My guess is it will go over his head until you are actually gone. Cutting the strings will set you free Logic. Who knows how it will affect him! Time will tell.
      ( By the way, if he gave you money to hold on to for the weekend, I would say stick to the plan he entered into with you. No games! )
      I hope you enjoy the weekend and that the rain holds off.
      Remember the boy is NOT your responsibility. Let his father look after him. I’m glad for your sake that you are moving on because you don’t want to look back in years to come and view yourself as a «prop».
      Your CG will have no choice but to act differently on some levels when you leave. The dynamics will certainly change for him.
      If I were in your shoes I would leave none of myself behind (Easier said than done, I know, believe me!) Make a clean break by blocking him from your phone and cutting contact for the first few months at least. You need time and space to organize the next phase of your life. You have tried your best. It is not your fault that you didn’t see results for your efforts
      Never blame yourself that he didn’t better himself on your watch.
      A CG has the power to suck people lifeless.
      I’m glad you are making a choice that will give you back control of your life .
      Best wishes for a wonderful future, one day at a time.

    • #5353

      I havent updated for a while or made it to «see» you all in the group.

      Thanks for all the kind messages. Start date is still a long way off (more than 2 months) so its still same old, different day. My current job have no idea that I will be leaving so I’m going to put a real spanner in the works there, which will be hell.

      Vera, I havent told «himself» yet. typically for me its all going to be very messy. Because my start date is such a long time off, its going to overlap with his 30th birthday. I decided not to tell him until i have a start date and i have handed in my notice. so i will have a very stressful week next week. I know i am going to be pretty low that week as i will be letting a lot of people down with my decision to move on (Not me, its right for me).

      Sadly the games happened this week. lies that his mum had his money, lies that he had sent money to me (inc a screenshot of a payment to me that would never make it to my account). And it all became too much for him. time with his son and time with me were sacrificed to escape into his own world.

      hard to see and hard to have to go through all of the lies and cover ups, still…again…
      But just another confirmation that nothing is going to change. So moving forwards is the right choice for me.

      I have tried my best. I tried again to speak to him as he has made a few references to having a stressful life, and also comments that its not easy for him to get to a bookies near me when he was visiting(so was actively looking). but he doesnt want to accept help. he doesnt want things to change.

      I followed it up with messages of support, which were ignored. It makes me sad that no matter how hard I try, its not enough.

      So yeah, a great future ahead, still not in touching distance yet.

    • #5354

      Hi Logic
      You have the ability to change ‘today’ and not let it be the same old, same old – the power to change lies in your hands.
      The games wont cease until you call it a day or he seeks to change his life which you are sure is not going to happen for some time yet.
      I cannot tell you what to do but it is highly probable that as long as you are available then he has hope of enablement – unwittingly you are allowing him to stay buoyant rather than allowing him to sink to the point where he has had enough.
      No matter how hard you try it will never be enough because you cannot save someone who doesn’t want to be saved and the only person getting hurt by all this is you.
      Why wait for the great future – reach out and grab it now. What is stopping you?

    • #5355

      I’m my own worst enemy.

      I cant make my escape for 5 weeks. My job is keeping me trapped here. The notice period feels like forever.

      That’s not to do with CG but it is the reason for most of my unhappiness and stress and then you throw a relationship with a CG on top of it.

      for the next 5 weeks im stuck in the mud not able to move on. whether it is with or without CG makes no difference. Its why i cant start my new.

      5 weeks, one day at a time…

    • #5356

      Hi Logic
      Try and find something good in each day – maybe you could find peace with a walk in a park or garden. I sat on a bench at the bottom of my garden today and a robin landed beside me, he cocked his head on one side and his wing brushed my leg – it was magical. I went out and bought some maggots for him and when I returned he did too and he enjoyed his meal within an inch of my hand. I forgot the world and lost myself in the beauty of nature.
      Maybe you could get a new hobby or have a spa session – anything to brighten your mood and make the stresses go away.
      You might not be able to change your job yet and move away but there is no reason to be stuck in the mud.
      Certainly if you factor in to your low mood a relationship with an active CG who is in denial then you are not going to get out of the mud – sometimes the only way forward is to pull ourselves up by your bootlaces and change the one person you can change and that is you.
      Use your time to look after you, don’t waste 5 weeks with regret – they are a drop in the ocean compared to your life.

    • #5357

      Velvet as always thanks for your kind words.

      I had actually taken your advice before I had even read it. Last night I took myself out to the countryside, sat on a hill and watched the sunset. It was wonderful. Gave me a lot of time to reflect and clear my head.

      My dad also sent me a lovely message to get me excited about my future again.

      Obviously, i havent been taking care of myself enough again. so need to go back to basics and work on that. Its just exhausting after 10 hours of v stressful work and treading on eggshells with crazyboss to have the time/energy. I need to do that.

      filling my week up next week with plans to keep me busy too. Royal ascot is a coming and i want to keep myself protected.

      Thanks for the perspective and reminder to do what’s right for me! sorry for the sucky mood!

      Logic x

    • #5358

      Sorry its been a while…….
      You have been really brave logic and I know you find it so hard to step back but as V said you can start your new life now. It is not about physical distance it is about a different way of seeing things. You deserve a happy life, you deserve kindness and if you are not going to give these things to yourself who is? Two unhappy people do not make anything better, being your best you can be is always going to be the best thing because one happy, stable person has to be better than none. Nothing is ever determinant and things will change you can help them change in the right direction by looing after yourself. The walk sounded lovely, I prescribe more of the same. Royal Ascot plays no part in your life, dreading these occasions will make no difference to the outcome so why not just mentally burn the racing calender?

      I always liked this quote ‘Incredible change happens in your life when you decide to take control over what you do have power over instead of crazing control over what you don’t.’ Lily x

    • #5359

      Lily, Velvet,

      Of course you lovely ladies are right as always. Good weather helps good mood so I’m feeling better about a lot of things.

      I think I’m finally seeing the light. Friday was more lies, which i already knew were lies but they had to be sorted out.
      Saturday we had a really lovely day just me and CG we talked about a lot of things but that included him talking about his bets. I don’t know why he wants to talk about them with me. Its like he is testing me.
      Sunday was awful. I was treated terribly and more arguing. CG hasnt spoken to me since he stormed out of his house to go to work.

      I finally handed my notice in at work. My boss seemed to align it with me having personal issues and needing to leave to be closer to my family rather than thats just where I want to be. But whatever makes him happy. That is finally a weight off my mind even if they do want me to work beyond my notice period.

      And then i messaged CG. I was very clear setting out why i was unhappy with the name calling and his action on the sunday and that it shows to me that he does not consider that he and I have a future together.

      And neither do I whilst his addictions are winning. Gambling is a selfish addiction it takes everything and gives nothing back. It drains him and I see it in him. And now it is draining me.

      That gambling had taken us down with it. And we were always so good together but the way it is at the minute we dont stand a chance. I hate that the house always wins.
      And i told him that i miss him.

      He carried on ignoring me and i still haven’t heard from him apart from him posting a video in a group chat we have with his sister, which was odd. He could have just sent it to his sister?

      For the first time in a very long time i feel like me again. I’m in control of everything in my life for the first time in over a year and am cutting out the two biggest stresses in my life. My job and gambling.

      Tiny steps forward are better than standing still right?
      Logic x

    • #5360

      Hi Logic
      Well done on handling your notice in – isn’t it strange that sometimes the things we dread the most turn out to be nothing to worry about?
      With regard to the name calling and poor treatment; I am not sure why you are still allowing yourself to be in a position where this CG can behave so badly towards you. Telling him that you miss him, when he is offering you so little, seems to me to be an invitation that you are still open for enablement if he plays his cards right. He even appears to have excited your mind enough to wonder why he posted a video to his sister in a group chat when I would have thought that he posted the video, in the way that he did, to obtain just the very reaction you had.
      If you were living with your CG I know it would be hard to make the break – every move can be watched and every action mulled over but with the distance you have surely it is possible to avoid all the poor behaviour of his addiction? Do you intend to stay in communication with his sister when you have made your break? I am sure she would understand if you told her that you are very sorry but that you will be unable to continue due to her brother’s ability to manipulate you with a supposed innocent group communication.
      I am concerned that by continuing to allow him to manipulate you up until the last minute, your are allowing yourself to carry the stress with you that you say you want to leave behind especially when you can cut one of the big stresses in your life out now.
      The only way for you to win is not to play the game Logic – look after yourself.

    • #5361

      Hi Velvet,

      I know why he posted the video. I sent him a message that he wasnt ready to reply to. That made him have to think about things but he wanted to contact me, and know I was there. Yeah its manipulation but i know him well enough in that situation to see what he is doing. I didnt reply to it.

      I know the way CG plays this now, to my enablement/codependency. Leave it for a few days and hope that I cant stand the fact that we arent talking or making things better etc. and if i dont reply to that send some sort of «have a nice life. find someone that makes you happy» type message. expecting me to fix it. This is the first time I didnt do it.

      And no, i dont know why i still let myself in for the name calling and the poor treatment. That is the unpredictable part and the part that can cut me up the most. It comes from nowhere. Sunday was the final straw for me on that. I wouldnt speak to my worst enemy the way that CG speaks to me at the minute. And that’s why i sent my text finally saying enough is enough. I dont want to play the game anymore. I want gambling out of my life.

      He finally came back to me yesterday saying that he had treated me badly and he appreciated what he had asked me to do on the sunday and that he knew that it wasnt easy for me «but that’s the way it is» and that I was right and that we had no future.

      I replied and said that something has to change and it cant continue the way that it is as we are two unhappy people making each other more unhappy and I dont want to do that anymore.

      I spoke to him about how unhappy he is at home and bored and that gambling loves that because it makes him vunerable to it and it will make him think well its more fun to chase a thrill than sit around doing nothing.

      But it is me that has to pick up the pieces. deal with the misplaced anger, the cancelled plans, the frustration and pain and guilt that builds up.

      and that i want to walk away from all the problems that make him so unhappy and destroy them and leave it in the past so I can move forward. And i want that for him too.

      but i understand that he isnt in a place where he can do that yet and he has to want it for himself.

      he admitted that he is miserable and trapped and that there is no point me being stuck in that trap too and i should take the chance to go. he actually spoke about how bad his betting had been recently and, to me, that’s huge for him to even say that to me.

      I told him he was trapping himself and that there’s support there if/when he needs it. he said that he will always be this way and will always be likely to bet.

      So i guess that’s my answer. As far as he is concerned, nothing will change.

      I wont really have plans to keep in touch with his sister. She is lovely and the only one that would ever be willing to talk to me about CG’s problems. But we dont talk enough for me to feel the need to keep in touch with her.

    • #5362

      Hi Logic,
      I haven’t posted for a while (due to bad internet, power cuts and good weather) but I have read your posts.
      A «clean»break is never what it says on the box (look at Brexit LOL!)
      Break ups are often difficult, painful, sad and «dirty».
      You are making 4 breaks.
      One with your job.
      The other with your location.
      Third with your «guy»,
      Fourth with your CG’s addiction.
      I have been through similar breaks in life and I have also experienced the ultimate break, Death ( being a golden oldie)
      I can tell you there is no easy route and there are «break ups» in life that are more difficult than death.
      Why? because the S.O is still there to haunt us.
      Your CG is playing all the games. He knows the knock on effects when he chooses to ignore you. He knows when to be apologetic. He knows how his self pity and sulking will tug on your heart strings. He says all the right things.
      When a CG speaks of how badly his bets are going, he really means » I need to try harder/bet more to resolve this». When he says «Things will never change I will always need to bet» he means «I’m going to use my CG label as an excuse to continue gambling. I don’t intend stopping (at least , not now»). When he roars/swears/ verbally abuses you , he is saying «Get out of my way. You are cramping my style/ it’s all your fault». When he posts «send to many videos/texts» he is laughing inside, knowing the person he intended them for will read/watch and walk straight into his trap.
      Words mean nothing to a CG so spare your words. Action is all we understand.Having our gambling supplies cut off is the greatest dread for a CG.

      Stop walking into his traps, Logic. There are many ways, apart from money that a CG gains enablement. He may be setting traps unconsciously but you need to be aware of the danger they impose.

      The ONLY way you will succeed in living a new life is to leave every little bit of him behind.
      I know how difficult that is.
      When I walked away from gambling, I returned many times.
      Because I left part of myself in the casinos.
      I know I said this before. Don’t leave any part of yourself behind.
      Pack up. Move on. Broken hearts heal. Wounds and scars fade. You will learn new coping skills as you move forward in life.
      If you allow your CG or his addiction to continuously open your wounds, they will fester and never heal.
      Gambling is a progressive illness.
      He is wearing his «victim’s cloak». His choice. Not your problem today.
      Kiss him good bye (on the cheek) and move on!
      It’s called TOUGH LOVE!

    • #5363

      Hi Vera,

      I’m grateful you sent this post when you did. hope you have been enjoying the sunshine! Congratulations on your pin! That’s an awesome achievement and commitment to the cause. hope youre feeling chuffed!

      I even printed your message off (hope you dont mind) and put it in my phone case to keep me on track — already looked at it 3 times to keep myself strong.

      i went through a terrible break up a few years ago and now i dont even think about it. i know i will get back to that place where im not affected by my past relationship but i wish i could fast-forward through the painful bit.

      Thank you for the CG-english translations. its hard to see the meaning behind what is going on, especially when the lies kick in too.

      I’m trying hard to stay away from the traps, I’ve said what i need to say now. finally. it has taken me 6 months of GT and counselling and sorting myself out to even say the words gambling and addiction to CG in the same sentence. i always tiptoed around it. knowing what we both meant but not really saying it.

      But its taken me that much time to even say that, i cant expect CG to just say «yeah okay now youve said that im done with this» but i have said my piece and i have to be strong and stick by it.

      CG says he is going to do the hard work for me and block me from everything. Not managed it yet though so just another test for me.

      we are entering new territory now. i normally would have fixed everything and patted him on the head for the bad behaviour. stupid enablement.

      today is CG’s payday and normally im on edge because we have something planned and i know that will be jepordised by the bookies. it feels so nice not to worry!

      trying to stay strong, my life is better without gambling in it!

      logic x

    • #5364

      Vera, that is such a great post and made a lot of sense, its not always possibe L, but it you can start afresh it would be such a clean start.

    • #5365


      i have the best opportunity for a new start. new job, new location, new home, new mindset.

      my biggest hindrance is myself! There is no better way to start afresh!

    • #5366

      Hi Logic
      Two things stand out for me in your latest posts and both are written as a result of you gaining experience and using it.
      The first is “ i cant expect CG to just say «yeah okay now youve said that im done with this» and the other is “my biggest hindrance is myself”
      Recovery doesn’t happen overnight, either for the CG who has indulged an addiction for years or for the non-CG who has been flummoxed by an addiction for years and spent too much time trying to change it.
      Nobody can ask for more than small steps although I found that with practice the steps do get longer and easier.
      Recognising that you have been even the ‘smallest hindrance to yourself’ is a self-awareness that is priceless. I think everyone I knew (including me) when they entered Gam-anon believed that they did not have a problem and struggled against the 7th step of the recovery programme ‘Humbly ask God (of our understanding) to remove our shortcomings.’
      Learning about ourselves and taking the experiences we have had and putting them to good use hopefully protects us from making the same mistakes again because if we don’t we go round in ever decreasing circles.
      Your new job sounds great and with your new awareness i am sure you will be brilliant. I cannot tell you what to do but I do believe it is good to allow yourself time before you enter another relationship. Take the time to look after you and give yourself the chance to find out what you really want out of life because second best will not do.
      Wishing you well

    • #5367

      Hi Logic

      I just wanted to wish you all the best in your new job /break away. I have read your thread and could relate alot to the feeling s and confusion you describe. My ex is a CG and I found this site a few years ago. It helped me gain more knowledge of the addiction and helped me gain the strength to change how I reacted.

      I still come back when I need to remind myself and read Velvet’s and others wise words and Vera’s straight talking. I admire your courage in moving on ; your new better life awaits.

      All the best

    • #5368

      Velvet, thank you for you post. I have come a long way in the last six months and that is down to you and GT for helping me find my way.

      Michelle, its good to hear from a new perspective and you are right, learning about addiction makes you stonger and able to deal with it.

      I havent seen CG for almost 2 weeks now and my how the tables have turned! After CG threatening to block me off all forms of messaging/social media and then not following through on it, the message seems to be getting through. I am done with the gambling game.

      He went on a 3 day drink/gambling bender and when he reaslised that i didnt care (obviously i do, but he cant see that) the behaviour started to change.

      He is currently abstaining from drinking/gambling (so I am told) which isnt hard when you blow all your money in one go. Today is his payday so we will see how strong his actions are there. It is also his little boys birthday at the weekend. Which is what I am finding toughest to deal with. For that little boy, nothing has changed and I dont want him to think that I have just disappeared from his life or i dont care about his birthday. None of that is his fault. I have debated posting his present (which i bought weeks ago) to CG but i just feel like im inviting gambling back towards me. I have no interest in that, my only thought is for that little boy not to feel like i dont care.

      Apart from that I’m strong. CG is being a lot more «present» than he has been in months. I think he knows that I am serious this time. I just have to remember it is his addiction seeking enablement, not him seeking me.

      Its not easy, but i do not miss gambling and its effects one jot!


    • #5369

      Hi Logic,
      How are things? I hope you are finding lots of time for you ad not dwelling on what your partner may or may not be doing, you really deserve to have a good life, to be kind to yourself and to love you as much as you love and care for others. Have you moved yet, when does the new job start? It can’t be long now? Thinking of you, Lily xx

    • #5370

      Hi Lily,

      Thanks for checking on me. I havent been doing very well at all really. Definitely taken a big backwards step and really need to put myself on the right track again.

      After I cut gambling out, CG seemed to be be wanting to make a change. He talked a lot about sorting himself out and kicked gambling for a couple of weeks. Which was great. But abstinence isnt enough and he crashed again last week and went on a bender (blamed on me).

      So yeah, its been a rough few weeks. I’m trying to protect myself and make time for me. This is helped by an old work colleague returning to the hell office for the summer. Its good to have her around again and i can talk to her easily about CG. but i could be doing more. Its just too hard to completely cut the tie at the minute…even though it shouldnt be.

      I leave my job in 3 weeks. Move out the week after and start my new job the week after that. so its finally starting to feel real and close.

      Thank you for thinking of me. i need to go back to my support and try again to make myself strong.

      Im so annoyed with myself.

      Logic x

    • #5371

      Its so easy to get sucked back in if you are still mentally available and it so hard not to remain so when you love someone. I have found if you fill your mind with other things and I am not talking clutter here, I am talking things you love, things that make You feel good, then it is much harder to be led back to a negative situation like this. You know enough to know he is not going to of gone into recovery over night and that he is likely missing his crutch, the stops him hitting rock bottom, that crutch is you. The problem until he has hit rock bottom he will have no desire to change, any abstinances will be because he is out of cash as time goes on and urgers get stronger he may resort to less legal means to get the money (although not all do).

      It may be for you the only way to give yourself a little perspective is to put that physical distance between you, being there for them and being full of the drama that creates and the urge to save can become just as much of an addiction to us as the gambling is to them. Leading by example, consitancy and not allowing the addiction to permiate our lives is the best thing we can do for them and is the best thing for us too. I know you know this and I think that is one of the reasons you are making this move but much like with your partner and his abstinance being conditional on him having no money and not being true recovery, you not slipping back into old patterns can not be solely reliant on distance alone. But if you find that thing whether it be running, horse riding, dressmaking, scuba diving or whatever that makes your heart sing and gives your life joy and purpose, then it will help you on to the road to recovery and thinking about the situation differently.

      I am struggling to find the time to post regularly at the moment but I am thinking of you you can be sure, Take care of YOU, Lily x

    • #5372

      I just wanted to say thank you for your wonderful reply on my post. You really have come so far. Looking forward to your next update. Lily x

    • #5373

      Hi Lily :0

      Thanks for your post. I am much better at receiving advice than giving it but i wanted you to know I was listening. I also want you to know that I have seen the other messages. I didnt want to comment as I would be pulling from memory and I did think that would help things at all.

      For what its worth, you already know how much you have helped me with my recovery but I also have a lot of respect for your partner. I always thought he would have been great for my CG to talk to if he had wanted to get help but hey…

      Hopefully i will be in the group to catch up tomorrow.

      I havent managed to update for a little while as I’ve had some things going on at home (making me glad that i will be closer to my parents soon). My grandad had a bad fall and has been in hospital and it was my uncle’s funeral on Monday and work, as always, is a killer (less than 2 weeks to go!!).

      As far as CG goes, we have been talking over text, not much more. He has been trying to be much nicer to me than he has been for a while but its all just lip service. A couple of weeks ago he sent me a screenshot saying he had won about a grand. It’s his 30th birthday this week. He said he was buying himself an expensive birthday present (which was what i planned to buy him for his 30th a few months after we met but its too big to have at his mums and obviously we havent made it that far). The present doesnt exist so that’s a nice chunk that has gone back to the bookies.

      If nothing changes, nothing changes. I still havent cut the ties, it was another stress i didnt need at the min and as he is being fairly chilled at the minute, i’ve not rocked the boat and caused more drama. But i am a lot more detached from the gambling and i do not miss it.

      I’ll try and do a proper response when my brain isnt so tired. I know this was a bit scatty.

      Logic x

    • #5374

      Hi Logic, You gave some excellent advice and a different view point which is why this forum is so useful. I too have a the greatest respect for my partner, he is a great human and has pulled himself out of bad situation that was all he had known his entire adult life that takes guts and determination which he has in spades. It also takes a stubborn streak which we both share!

      Getting that screen shot must of been really upsetting and I am sorry to hear about your uncle and your grandad. Continuing with your plans takes strength so don’t knock yourself. Distancing yourself is an easy thing to talk about but not so easy to carry out emotionally, sometimes it is easier to do it physically and then the emotional side will follow. Keeping busy and do things that fulfill you is always good I find.

      Keep on keeping on and things will change without you even realising. I’ll be thinking about you and be nie to ‘see’ you in the group tomorrow if you can make it. Lily x

    • #5375

      I’m not sure how much i want to post here today. Maybe I will save some things to discuss in the forum tomorrow…

      Friday i had messages from CG that he was really low. blown all of his salary, gambled up to £2000 and lost it all. I spoke to him on the phone (he was drunk and he kept telling me he was going to drink himself to death and then hung up). he didnt and he was fine aside from feeling sorry for himself. he self excluded on all of his online apps.

      CG turned 30 on Sunday. I went and saw him and it was actually a really nice day. I could tell he was really stressed though. He had blown all of his money. His sister kept pressuring him to go out, after all it was his 30th, and he really didnt want to. in the end he did and he was very drunk and rounding up the various members of family was like hearding drunk sheep!

      The next day was very rough for everyone including myself and in hindsight i should have just left but i had said i would stay to look after his little boy on Tuesday. I chose to sleep off my hangover, CG chose hair of the dog.

      I’d also found out he had been at his ex’s in the week (as i knew was starting to happen) and he had lied about it. i spoke to him about it not realising how much he had drank, because i had been outside playing football with his son.

      So he started having a go at me about it. told me to leave. i didnt as his son was upset that i wasnt going to be there. We argued and he was physical before actually throwing me out of the house.

      I’m so angry with myself as I am typing this. that i let myself be in that position. that i shouldnt have gone to see him at all, or i should have walked away sooner.

      but now, i know that door is closed. i never need to look back. and if i have any respect for myself i never ever will do. I am done with gambling. I am done with him. The next two weeks cannot pass by quickly enough.

      I’m really disappointed with myself. I’ve let myself down and i’ve come so far to then let myself fall like this. i feel weaker than i have in a long time, when i should be at my strongest. I didnt listen to the wonderful advice i have been given and ive taken an enormous step back.

      Huh, turns out i posted it all after all.

    • #5376

      Dear Logic
      If only we were all blessed with hindsight we would never get in predicaments again that we regretted afterwards.
      However, always look for the positive side of sad experiences, maybe your hand has been forced but finally the blinkers are off and that is so often the turning point. After 25 years it wasn’t me that walked away, it was my CG because I could no longer enable him — and yet I write to others all the time that controlling their own lives is the right way forward – oh yes precious hindsight!
      It doesn’t matter what we are told Logic we have to make our own mistakes – it’s why I cannot ever say if you do this or that then this or that will happen.
      Don’t be disappointed with yourself, be proud of the fact that you have planned a future for yourself and this has not cast you back into limbo.
      I can see an enormous step forward – now is the time to listen to Logic and don’t look back.
      Well done

    • #5377

      Dear Velvet,

      Thanks for the prompt response — desperately needed.

      I think i have made enough mistakes now. its too draining, i dont want it. it’s just really hard to let him go. so much has happened.

      but i know i just need to get through the next two weeks and i will feel sooooo much better but this is everything i have known for a long time.

      I spent a long time talking to Harry (thanks Harry — plan to follow) and starting to slowly remove CG from my life.

      Today has been a write off. emotions are all over the place.

      i dont feel proud of myself i dont feel like im moving in the right direction. hopefully, i will again soon.

      it just been a tough few days.

    • #5378

      Sorry to read of your setback, Logic.
      It is understandable that you would «clutch at straws», It is difficult to let go.
      The good news is you have gained a new layer of awareness.
      «What you are aware of, you are in control of; what you are not aware of is in control of you»!
      Don’t look back.

    • #5379

      What a tough lesson. Someone told me once if you don’t listen to what the universe (I prefer to say experience) is telling you the lessons will get harder until your either listen or everything breaks down and you have to begin again. It doesn’t make it any easier I know but I do believe you have been sent this very clear message now and you have listened, believe it or not even at this point even not everyone does. At least you can leave now with no doubts you are doing the right thing. We all want to make it work, sometimes though you realise that you have come to a point when you realise that you have to either cut lose or go down with a sinking ship. Experiences you have truly learnt from can never be a mistake but I know they can also be very painful lessons. Remember it is not your fault, you have done nothing wrong. Thinking of you. Lily x

    • #5380

      It is never acceptable for someone to be physical with their partner and it most certainly isn’t down to the CGing. It shows a dangerous side to your partners make up even without the gambling in my view. I hope you were not seriously hurt (physically at least) x

    • #5381


      I just feel like my clutching at straws has made everything worse. i feel so vulnerable and low. I’ve got so much to do at work and im getting none of it done. just moping.

      Lily, you are totally right. I can leave knowing i am 100% doing the right thing. Seeing his little boy’s awareness was awful. i can only imagine how confusing it was for him once i left.

      Need to cut my losses or go down with the sinking ship — i like that a lot.

      Dont worry — bruised ego more than anything. the physical stuff came from too much drink, it wasnt gambling related. it was enough for a short, sharp shock to the system. i agree there is nothing i have ever done to provoke a physical reaction. but i wasnt seriously hurt.

    • #5382

      I am glad it wasn’t a more serious assault and hope to see you in the group tomorrow. It’s understandable you are licking your wounds at the moment but try not to dwell on it for too long, whats done is done, time to move forward. I find a walk helps blow off the cobwebs. Take care and go easy on yourself, Lily x

    • #5383

      I’ll be there tomorrow.

      Need to toughen up for my own sake. too nice for my own good!

      I actually did a 7 mile walk around cheddar gorge yesterday. no chance of walking today chained to my desk though!

      «see» you tomorrow

      Logic x

    • #5384

      Hi Logic
      CGs use manipulation and charm to gain their enablement. Drink is not a reason or excuse for physical violence.
      In my opinion you are definitely walking towards a better future.

    • #5385

      Hi Velvet.

      Point understood. my ref was in reply to Lily that violence was not a result of CGing.

      Im not making any excuses for physical abuse. There is no excuse. He knows it was wrong and crossed all sorts of lines.


    • #5386

      CG’s «phone has stopped working» so he has a new number. I don’t have it. His old number isn’t working.

      I have my burner phone ready for tomorrow night.
      Gone from social media
      Plans for Saturday sorted with housemate who doesnt know about the CGing. Sunday is still free at the minute but less of an issue as he can’t get to me and i don’t want to go to him. I need to do some work on Sunday anyway.

      Monday and Tuesady in work.

      One of Wed or Thurs i will be with my friend. The other day is for packing.

      Friday seeing old work colleagues in Birmingham

      Saturday black spot but i’ll fill it — CG is away camping anyway

      Sunday parents coming to help me move

      Monday moving day.

      I think that’s everything

    • #5387

      Hi Logic, sorry you had so many connection problems in the group. I hope you are ok and all set for the big move now. Thinking of you x

    • #5388

      Well its done. I’m back at my parents with more stuff that can ever possibly fit in this room.

      Last couple of weeks have been a whirlwind. No matter how much online protection there was i wasnt prepare for him turning up at my house…with flowers…and small child (oh manipulation — couldn’t possibly have the guts to turn up by yourself in case of rejection) that was hard, it was very much going through the motions and i took my moments to spend my last time with that lovely little boy. I’ll miss him a lot.

      CG left in a strop I’m not really sure why. I think he wanted me to stop him, i didn’t.

      He has seen me posting on the F&F group and asked what i was doing. I didn’t want to talk about it in front of the little boy but told him about it the next day and how amazing the support is. He said he wanted to get involved in it but unfortunately it was on Friday night so no groups and none over the weekend and by Monday he had lost interest. But he did read some of what people had written on my journal and commented how good it was to hear people that thought the same was as him. Not enough to truely engage in the process.

      Then for a few days i had my perfect bf from months ago back. Free from drink, free from gambling, free from stress and with money still in his back pocket the day before payday. It was really good to see him like that again and not just miserable and dragged down.

      And then he went camping with his friends for the weekend. It was his bday present from them so back on the booze for the whole weekend and ended up in a casino (he has never been to a casino in the entire time I’ve known him, so why do that now). He assured me he didn’tbetthankyouverymuch and it was the only place to get a drink that late on.

      But obviously two days of drinking and not much sleep have taken their toll and he is back to miseryland. No interest in helping me move, no interest in saying goodbye. Fine. At least i know what i meant now…

      There’s no point in us talking anymore. He is 150miles away so that’s all nails in the coffin. Shame it ended that way. I don’t think he thinks thats the last he will see of me (he invited me to the beach later this week). And obviously I’m the bad guy. I quit my job and my home without consulting him (i did speak to him) and I’ve been too hastey and i will regret what I’ve done. It makes me question whether i was clear enough about why i needed to leave, but his behaviour the last few weeks makes me think he gets it, but at then end of the day a CG can’t blame themselves.

      Time to live my life free from an addiction that isn’t mine x

    • #5389

      Hiya Logic
      Not so much nails in the coffin but hopefully light at the end of the tunnel for both of you.
      Wondering if you didn’t make it clear enough that you were going is not going to change anything so just get on now and enjoy your gamble-free world – I suspect in your new job you will hear about addiction again and this experience will be something for you to refer to but not get sucked into.
      You can only live ‘your’ life Logic, you tried to save him from himself but in the end it is down to him. 150 miles sounds like a good distance, I hope he will reflect and perhaps glance again at this site. It was interesting that he only seemed to feel that it was ‘good’ that others felt like him – maybe when he looks again he will see that it isn’t good but that taking a leap of faith and controlling his addiction is very good.
      Speak soon

    • #5390

      Sorry for all you are dealing with Logic. Relationships are hard enough without throwing addiction into the mix.

      My 28 year old son has been a compulsive gambler for 10 years. The one thing that I can tell you is that it is ALL consuming and even small periods of abstinence do not bring back the non addict. Recovery from addiction takes a lot of work and a long time working some sort of program. It does not just go away on it’s own. Your BF hasn’t even hit the point of admitting he is an addict which is why your relationship has always been a roller coaster… that is all he is currently able to give. It does not help that it seems he is surrounded by loved ones that continue to give him a place to live and keep him from hitting the hard ground of rock bottom. I know it is cliche but I really don’t think most addicts can move forward until they have hit this uncomfortable place.

      You are obviously a young girl and I am so impressed how you have put yourself … moving for a better job. You go girl!!

      We all on this side of the forum struggle with the stark reality that nothing we do or say will ever change the CG. It has nothing to do with us… it is addiction:(


    • #5391

      How’s the new life? I hope you can see things more clearly now you have some distance. I am worried you spent time with him again after he was physically abusive to you and I do hope you will think about that if you are ever tempted back. You deserve so much more logic, you are bright and self aware and have so much too offer someone who is able to recipricate and give you what you need. Thinking of you, Lily x

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